Episode 50 - Celebrating 50 episodes and Martha Stewart

0:15 Episode 52 crime besties welcome.

0:19 Here we are. Some said we'd never make it.

0:23 Oh. Who?

0:24 Who? Actually, at at some point, both

0:26 of us. Yeah, Can you imagine?

0:29 We're back like, you know, thinking back to like episode 1

0:32 and like just getting the guts to like freaking speak into the

0:34 microphone. And now we're at 50. 50 we're

0:37 we're a year in. Yeah, yeah.

0:40 Amazing. Yeah, well, it was more than a

0:41 year ago that we recorded that first episode.

0:43 It was, yeah. Pulled down now, which I think

0:45 meant to record twice from memory.

0:47 Yes, we did. We had a bit of a technical

0:50 issue. We didn't have producer Pete on

0:51 board, I think at that point. So I think we're all learning

0:54 still. So yeah, we've come a long way

0:58 in 50 episodes. Our sound quality certainly

1:01 gotten better. So if anyone's discovering us

1:03 for the first time, please forgive the first.

1:05 I think it was 10 episodes. Yeah.

1:07 Until we got better equipment. But we did our best.

1:10 We didn't know what we didn't know.

1:11 So yeah, that's OK. We leave and we learn and we're

1:15 growing all the time. We still have those original

1:18 marks. I like pulling out every now and

1:19 then. I like the look of them.

1:20 Me too. They are pretty cool.

1:22 Yeah, they're they're OK, but they're not like what we've got

1:26 now. Oh God.

1:26 No, no. When I go back and like you

1:27 listen to those original episodes, it's like.

1:31 Oh, oh, yeah. I mean, oh, yeah, they're not,

1:33 they're not amazing. But you know, look at us.

1:36 Oh my 50. So it's in Love it.

1:39 We're recording on a Wednesday night tonight, though, because

1:42 random, because our bloody kids have a curriculum day on Friday.

1:45 So we've had to shuffle things around.

1:48 The things we do. Yeah, the things we do.

1:51 But I love the routine we're getting into so much that like,

1:53 I was around at my mum's the other night and she's like, oh

1:56 by the way, of course I'll have the kids on Friday for you so

1:58 you can record. Oh, Patty.

2:01 But we've already organized, we've already worked out we're

2:04 going to do, enabled it, give a system another time.

2:06 Well, clearly you'll need time to record.

2:08 Number one priority. Thanks, Pat.

2:12 Appreciate that. Absolutely.

2:14 But yeah, no, we can manage it. We can do this.

2:15 And we're a little bit dusty and tired after a long day of work,

2:18 etcetera, but we're here. And it's just telling Meg.

2:21 I was woken at 2:45 this morning by a child who I think got cold.

2:27 When I walked into his room this morning, his blankets were all

2:30 on the floor, so he came into our bed.

2:32 But I didn't go back to sleep after he came back in because I

2:35 thought it was time to get up. That's just that.

2:38 It wasn't. And then I was too awake anyway.

2:41 So forgive me if my, you know, it's like my bedtime.

2:45 Oh, anytime it's gonna be. It's almost my bedtime.

2:47 Actually, now I'm a shocker. Meg's a midnight.

2:51 Meg's a midnight bedtime gal I. Can't I can't do anything

2:55 different. It just, I don't know, I'm a

2:57 weirdo and I I'm a night. You're a weirdo.

2:59 You're a night owl. That's OK.

3:01 Because the mornings freaking suck.

3:03 Yeah, I bet. I can't handle mornings.

3:05 Yeah, I'm sorry, but fuck off. See.

3:08 I I wake up bright eyed and bushy tailed but I'm in bed by

3:11 like 930, asleep by 10 pretty much. 9:30 is still halfway

3:14 through the day. Lunch, anyway.

3:17 What do you do that time of night?

3:18 Oh, OK, see, it's by the time I get the kids off and done

3:22 completely and then do a few tidy up things around the house,

3:25 it's 99. You know, you're pushing that

3:28 9930 as it is that then I that's my time.

3:31 I like it right. What's a show I want to watch?

3:33 OK, and I'll watch like one of my my series I've got going or

3:36 something. You know what I'm watching at

3:38 the moment. That's amazing.

3:39 Sirens have you? Watched it, I haven't.

3:43 Oh, get do. Yourself.

3:44 I have heard about it. I've it's actually you're going

3:47 to say. Something else then?

3:48 Oh, what? Well, it's season 2 of Secret

3:52 Lives of Mormon White at the moment.

3:54 Loving that, absolutely loving that, and I love the fact that

3:57 they dumped the entire season in one go.

3:59 I was in shock because I didn't Bravo.

4:01 I didn't know was. It bravo, whatever.

4:04 One of those, one of those I. Feel like it's got Andy Cohen

4:06 written all over it. I was, I had no idea that like

4:10 there was that it had been, it had been released.

4:14 And I was like, oh, what? I'm going to watch, you know,

4:15 and like went flicking through and then went it's, it's out and

4:19 then realise the whole season was there and I'm like.

4:22 Oh my God, that's gift. But at the point.

4:24 But I got to the final episode. Oh.

4:26 I'm not even. Oh yeah, yeah oh, 'cause I had a

4:27 weekend without the kids so I was like bring to this yeah and

4:31 I got to the end but all I didn't think it was the end

4:33 because cliffhanger. Oh and I'm like, hate that.

4:37 I'm like, I just assumed oh OK, they've released the 1st 10,

4:41 there's more to come or something.

4:42 Yeah and I'm like there'll be another one next week.

4:44 Went there and then it didn't come and I was like, Oh no, like

4:48 that's. No.

4:49 So we have to wait until next year.

4:51 That is shit. I'm really annoyed.

4:54 That is really. Shit, although I've now it's

4:56 stupidly gone down a rabbit hole of like the whole Jen and Zach.

5:01 Oh, Affleck. Oh.

5:03 And I've been listening to like the viral files.

5:05 Oh, it's actually so good. Yeah.

5:08 What? What are your thoughts on him?

5:11 OK, so during this season I'm flipping around 'cause I

5:13 actually by the end of this season, I'm actually like, it's

5:15 her. But I feel for her entirely.

5:18 I don't want, don't get me wrong, yeah, she goes through a

5:20 real tough time. Tough time, Yep.

5:22 But I think she's kind of caused it in the in the in her

5:27 behaviour. Drama I.

5:29 Don't know that likes the drama and I think she she lies and she

5:32 doesn't realise that she's lying yeah and I think she gets

5:34 herself caught up in these things and all of a sudden it's

5:36 now. Oh, but why is everyone turning

5:38 on turning on me? Because you didn't tell the

5:41 truth. You've spun things for one

5:43 person and and now you're upset. Why?

5:46 The other persons are like, angry with you.

5:48 But you said the wrong thing. Yeah.

5:50 Yeah. So I think it's a bit her.

5:51 Yeah. But he's.

5:52 Oh, I mean, there's absolutely ingrained misogyny in him 100.

5:56 Percent there's ingrained misogyny in.

5:59 In the church, absolutely. And so it's it is what he's

6:02 growing up with and I can see him trying he's.

6:04 Trying, trying. Well, at least he's trying on

6:06 camera. Yeah, but there's in that file

6:08 files, Yeah, like episode, there's some stuff in that that

6:11 he says that I'm like, oh dude. Mate, Yeah.

6:14 No, he still hasn't quite. He's not all the way there yet.

6:16 No. You know, good on him for

6:17 trying. Yeah.

6:18 Well, it's more work to be done. Yeah, yeah.

6:22 At least he's acknowledged the fact that there is work that

6:23 needs to be done. This is true in that.

6:25 Sorry to everybody who doesn't watch more.

6:28 You're not. I get on it.

6:29 Can't believe you don't. No.

6:31 Start from Season 1 Sirens. I have to say.

6:34 Julianne Moore. Oh my God, I love her.

6:37 Oh. She is great.

6:38 Kevin Bacon. Excuse me?

6:40 Why have I not? Oh, you need it is it is

6:43 phenomenal bacon and. They laugh.

6:46 Don't. Don't we all?

6:49 I've actually been following him on Instagram.

6:51 Oh my God, Yeah, He's, I love him, Yeah.

6:55 He's got, he's good. He's awesome.

6:57 Anyway, a couple of recos for everybody.

6:59 One day we need to work out our 6° of separation to him.

7:02 Oh. We will.

7:03 That's actually fair. We should probably do that.

7:05 Yeah. That should be a priority

7:06 before. Pretty sure I've done it once

7:07 before, but I reckon we, yeah, we can definitely do that, yeah.

7:10 OK, cool. Yeah, I'll make a note of it so

7:12 that we don't forget. Please do.

7:16 Very. Important 50th episode.

7:18 We did put a shout out to everybody to see who they wanted

7:23 us to cover and what we wanted to do.

7:25 And we decided to go with something a little lighter than

7:27 what we normally do because, you know, we've had a lot of doom

7:30 and gloom over 50 episodes. Yeah, the previous 49 episodes.

7:34 So today we're going to be covering the case of Martha

7:37 Stewart. Oh, I have loved researching

7:39 this. It's given me life.

7:41 So I'm actually given me life as opposed to sometimes when we're

7:44 researching, I'm like, oh. It's so hard, like so.

7:47 Hard. Sometimes you just walk away.

7:50 It's been great. I was telling you this morning,

7:51 I was in the shower and the kids were in the bathroom with me.

7:53 And I mean, don't call child protection or anything, but we

7:57 were listening to some Snoop Dogg and some Doctor Dre,

8:01 obviously. Absolutely.

8:04 Anyway, it was really good fun. So it's really kind of like

8:07 reacquainted me into that, that scene as well.

8:11 I'm not hating. We should.

8:12 You just don't think that. You say Martha Stewart, and

8:14 that's got It's gonna be what you think of next.

8:17 Hold on a minute it. Is now time but.

8:19 If you don't know we will get to it, we'll get there.

8:22 I have some shoutouts before we start and then it's been.

8:25 A big week. It's been a massive week.

8:27 We have had so much engagement this week, so please, we can't

8:32 shout out everybody because it is just, yeah, it's huge.

8:36 The amount of messages, the amount of DMS, the amount of

8:39 likes and comments and everything that we've been

8:41 getting. We love it.

8:42 Please, we we see everything. Even if we don't reply to

8:45 everything, we try and catch up. I was just catching up just then

8:48 when we were setting up. But thank you so much because

8:51 when we see them coming through, it really does motivate us to

8:54 keep going. Absolutely.

8:55 That means so, so, so much to us.

8:57 Yeah. So on that note, I would like to

9:01 shout out Lauren Pentland and Karen Cardwell.

9:06 So they both have bought us coffees in the past week.

9:09 Karen actually asked us to shout out her brother Nick because

9:13 Nick got her into the podcast and.

9:15 We shout out Nick. Nick before.

9:16 Is it maybe? Different Nick.

9:17 I feel like we've shouted out and Nick before, but I'm not.

9:20 Sure. I don't know if it's the same 1.

9:21 I don't know if it's the. Same one.

9:23 But yeah, Nick, thanks for sharing the love.

9:25 That's exactly what we need to If everyone shared it with one

9:28 person, that will tell us true crime.

9:30 Yeah, it would well might even be able to monetize.

9:34 Oh, that would be amazing. We also have a shout out another

9:38 a few other people have actually bought us coffees this week as

9:40 well. We've had Talia Lee.

9:42 So Talia is actually the girlfriend, the partner of

9:46 Peter's best mate. And she wrote that she's, she

9:51 found our back catalog, I think, and now she's all caught up and

9:54 she doesn't know what she's gonna listen.

9:55 To that's, I'm getting a lot of that at the moment.

9:57 Yeah. We hope you're getting there.

9:58 We're getting there. So thank you.

10:00 Thanks Talia and Terry Shannon as well bought us a coffee as

10:03 well. So thank you very much to

10:05 everybody. It really still blows me away

10:07 that people, you know, are donating to us to enable us to,

10:14 you know, continue the podcast and really see that value in our

10:16 work. So thank you to everybody.

10:18 But in equal measure, we really appreciate comments likes all of

10:22 those things all go towards growing and doing all of the

10:25 things that I. Just I just say it's even just

10:27 like that, you know, motivation to like, oh, absolutely, totally

10:30 does help you get like get along.

10:31 I mean, every time, like I'm as I'm like looking at a a case.

10:35 And and as you say, sometimes it's hard.

10:37 Yeah. I mean, when you get a bit, Oh

10:38 my God, I can't, if I can read any more about this case,

10:39 whatever. But you're getting the messages

10:41 at the same time about people who are enjoying what we're

10:43 doing. Yeah.

10:44 For such a variety of reasons that you're like, no, I've got

10:47 to keep going. Like we've got to keep.

10:48 Doing this, it's really good fun.

10:49 Yeah, I mean in a in a weird way.

10:51 Yeah, in a weird. Well, I mean, it was a weird

10:53 way. We're out on Saturday night, the

10:55 two of us at a show for Doctor Rachel Toles, who is a

10:58 psychologist and she did a show in Melbourne here, psychology of

11:02 serial killers that we went and saw and it was really

11:05 fascinating. But it was very interesting this

11:08 like everyone's, you know, it's why are we interested in serial

11:10 killers and all these sorts of things that was discussed and it

11:12 was, it was really interesting to see why I loved her take on

11:15 it. Oh, me too.

11:16 That whole, you know, like that we spend so much time as females

11:20 trying to escape these sorts of, you know, like walking through

11:22 car parks, etcetera, that we, this is our, you know, our

11:24 research to make sure we, we stay safe.

11:26 Yeah, that's so, yeah. I think that's really

11:28 fascinating that how we we, we just love true crime and there's

11:32 so many people that do. Yeah.

11:34 Well, so Rachel is a Canadian forensic and criminal

11:38 psychologist and she filled Hammer Hall, which is one of our

11:44 big theatres in in Melbourne. And I think they said there were

11:47 1700 people there and it was, it was amazing.

11:50 And you know, everyone there was a true crime fan.

11:53 And in sitting in the row in front of us, I don't know if you

11:55 noticed, but sitting to my right, there were a couple of

11:58 teenage boys. They didn't see that, yes.

12:01 I'm like, oh, this is actually further reaching than I thought.

12:04 You know, I didn't really think, but I found her take on serial

12:08 killers very, very interesting. Yeah, she, she talks about the

12:12 formula of a serial killer and she, I mean, she goes into it in

12:17 a lot of detail. And she said she's publishing or

12:19 about to publish a book about it.

12:21 So keep an eye on it. Look at her Instagram.

12:23 She's got a really good Insta. She she does it.

12:25 Instagram's fantastic. Yeah, she's.

12:27 Really, really informative but really engaging as well.

12:31 So she says there that there are sort of nine hallmarks to the

12:36 making of a serial killer. And all of the serial killers

12:38 that she studied have all nine of these hallmarks.

12:42 So they are genetics or generational trauma issues from

12:46 mom, issues from dad, the home life.

12:50 So moving around, you know, some kind of disruption in, in the

12:55 home life of the child, the the child's brain aged 3 to 5.

13:00 And this is where they developed paraphilia, which I found that.

13:02 That was fascinating. I didn't.

13:04 Realize it was so early and in such a short span of time like

13:08 it has to happen within that three to five age bracket to

13:11 kind of yeah, really cementing and when.

13:13 You think about brain growth and development, Yeah, they are the

13:16 key years of that sort of thing going on.

13:18 It's it's so unbelievable. But yeah, and that's so

13:21 ingrained from that point. That's yeah.

13:23 Brain injury. So she's talking about, you

13:26 know, injuries from sporting things, from being dropped as a

13:31 baby. Traumatic, Traumatic.

13:32 Yep. All of that, like, could be

13:34 deprivation at birth, All of those things.

13:36 Yeah. Yeah.

13:37 But all of them have a brain injury of some sort.

13:40 Yeah. All of them have been bullied at

13:41 some point or had trouble making friends.

13:45 Ages 8:00 to 11:00. They have a significant life

13:47 event or a significant traumatic event.

13:49 Yeah. And then hormones.

13:51 So yeah. But look, please follow it.

13:54 It was awesome. I really really.

13:56 Fascinated and reflecting back on the ones that we have like

13:59 discussed here and, and looking at those markers you kind of I

14:03 kept because I sat there I said to you the question I had was

14:06 there'll be an outlier like who's the outlier?

14:08 I want to know who the outlier is and like, but everyone I kept

14:10 going back over of what we've talked about, like, no, no, no,

14:13 that one's not it. No, no, I can tick all those

14:15 boxes for that one. And yeah, it's pretty, pretty

14:18 crazy. And for her to.

14:19 Say that every serial killer she studied.

14:21 Oh, she studied way more than. Exactly than we would know like

14:24 that's that's really fascinating.

14:26 Couple more shout outs before we get on move on.

14:29 There's Emma Pav, Nicole, Rebecca Hillam and I've got a

14:34 couple of personal shout outs. So today I bumped into an ex

14:37 work colleague of mine named Edwinner, and she said she

14:40 watches us. Oh God, on our TV.

14:45 Oh, so thanks, Win and a wave. Yeah.

14:49 And also I thought 50th episode. I'll do a shout out to producer

14:53 Pete. Well, we should, shouldn't we?

14:55 He wouldn't come in. Come join us.

14:56 No. So we were like, let's talk

14:59 about our favorite episode over the last 50 or the last 49.

15:03 So we're going to talk about that in a SEC, but we really

15:06 want to produce a Pete to come in and tell us what his worth

15:08 we. Can tell him what he said.

15:09 We can say what he said, but he didn't want to come on on

15:11 camera. He said.

15:12 We're the talent. Well, he's not wrong.

15:15 No. We'd show him up for sure.

15:18 Oh God, yeah. Anyway, so his favourites were

15:20 Snowtown because he said he didn't really know anything

15:23 about. That and learned a lot and.

15:24 Learned a lot. And then we went there.

15:26 Yeah. And he got to be in a tick tock.

15:28 Yeah. Yeah.

15:29 So, you know, liked that, yeah. And then also the Elizabeth

15:32 Holmes Theranos, because you dressed up because.

15:34 He likes it when you dress up. Oh, gross.

15:39 You know, in a black turtleneck and my hair slicked.

15:41 Back like the Rock. Yeah, my heavy gold chains.

15:46 Yeah. Dark.

15:47 Yeah. Alright, I need to know.

15:49 Yeah. What is or are your favorite

15:53 episodes that we've done? OK, up until now, similar to

15:56 producer Pete, I've got a favorite that like was the light

16:00 one. I guess I really enjoyed doing

16:02 Melissa Kadik. Oh yeah.

16:05 And and the fact that there's still really like this

16:07 overhanging of like, is she hopping around somewhere like

16:10 without a foot situation? Like, and even recently, just

16:13 the other day, someone on Tiktok, there was quite a few

16:15 people all of a sudden randomly studied.

16:17 Like I had some polls up back then on our Tik Toks and we

16:20 always all of a sudden got some like people putting answers in

16:24 on the pole and it was still think she's alive.

16:27 And I looked at the pole and went, jeez, we've now got quite

16:29 a few people who've commented who've, you know, selected 1 and

16:32 it was like 50 to 48%. Like it was like, yeah, it was

16:37 really interesting that it's really quite split.

16:39 Yeah. That of like people think of

16:41 terms in terms of whether or not she's still around or not.

16:45 So that was, I really enjoyed that.

16:47 And I mean, pause off, I mean, because you can't listen to the

16:50 music. Pause is on.

16:52 Love it. It's that music.

16:54 Just it's the best. That was that really was.

16:57 Yeah, that was great. Yeah.

17:00 But then in terms of a really, I guess that was a really tough

17:03 case to like investigate, like investigate from that

17:05 perspective of like doing all that.

17:07 But at the same time, it was, I wasn't really proud of how we

17:10 just like put it out there and put more light on it.

17:13 I felt like a lot of people commented around the fact of

17:15 like, you know, they hadn't thought about this case in a

17:16 long time and brought it to the forefront again.

17:19 I think was that the Candalese 1 and Carly and Candalese.

17:23 I think that was a a good. Lost bills?

17:25 Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

17:26 That was a that was a toughy. I found that one really hard.

17:29 Yeah, but yeah. But I enjoyed what it did.

17:32 Yep. Yeah.

17:34 And that's part of the reason in a way.

17:35 I mean, we, we, we're not deluded.

17:37 We know that we're not, you know, solving the world's

17:40 problems over here. But no, one of the things when

17:43 we talked about starting the podcast was about bringing

17:46 awareness to cases. And if we can do that, great,

17:49 because it keeps the memory alive of those people who've

17:53 been victims or survivors in these situations.

17:56 And yeah, that's kind of part of the motivation for us in in with

18:01 certain cases in particular. Yeah, definitely.

18:03 Yeah. Yeah.

18:04 My favorite. Yeah.

18:06 I've got three. Yeah.

18:07 So I really liked the Sophie Toscan Duplontier Yeah episode

18:12 because I, well, I actually really liked the drunk horse

18:14 anecdotes. That when you brought that, I

18:17 was like, oh, this is gold. And I also like really enjoyed

18:22 researching that one. I know, I mean, she obviously

18:24 met a very, very tragic end to her life, but I found her life

18:28 really fascinating and I didn't know a huge amount about her as

18:33 a person. I'd heard about the case and I

18:35 knew roughly about the case, but that was AII actually quite

18:39 enjoyed researching that one. The Beaumont children was

18:42 another one for me because again, in Australia, that's one

18:46 that everybody knows. And to find out more information

18:50 about it and go a little bit deeper in researching it.

18:54 I, I, I felt like, again, we probably did that justice and

18:59 you and I both formed an opinion that you never know, it might

19:02 actually come to something now. So there's been a little bit of

19:05 development since we've recorded that.

19:07 But yeah, it was, I, I don't know, it was so tragically sad.

19:13 But still, people, as you said before, people commented on it

19:19 and really liked finding out details that they didn't know

19:23 previously. Because we know those kids

19:25 weren't missing. That's about what people know.

19:27 But yeah, the detail of it the. Detail of it, yeah.

19:30 And the tragedy of what those parents went through, Like, I

19:32 didn't know all of that side of it, you know?

19:34 Like, yeah, that what what transpired for them was really

19:37 tragic. Yeah.

19:39 And then my third was, and this is actually not a very popular

19:42 episode that we've put out, but I, again, really enjoyed

19:46 researching it and it was kind of like from a very different

19:49 perspective. But it was the Aaron Hernandez

19:51 episode, yeah. So first of all, I mean, it

19:54 wasn't the worst thing in terms of pictures to look at, so.

19:58 You know, did enjoy it. Was that especially that tight

20:01 shirt with his handcuffs behind him?

20:03 But. But it was also the fact of,

20:06 like, the CTE that his brain then showed after, you know,

20:11 after everything kind of went through after he passed away.

20:14 Yeah. And that being an explanation

20:17 for possibly why things happened.

20:18 I mean, it's no excuse. It's not.

20:20 Excuse, but yeah. Possibly an explanation for what

20:23 was going on for him and the more I read about CTE and it

20:27 gets referred to a lot now more yeah, a lot more now in the

20:30 media you've. Rachel Tolls brought it up the

20:32 other night, you know? Yeah, yeah.

20:35 And you hear about it on the news.

20:36 You hear about it when you know our elite athletes are choosing

20:40 not to participate. Far more research into that side

20:43 of things and the brain, yeah. Like, I think about it from a

20:45 grassroots perspective, being that our kids all play footy and

20:49 AFL football, which is really rough.

20:51 Yeah. And they don't wear helmets.

20:53 Not that. I mean, we went through all of

20:54 this in the air and Fernandez case, but yeah, it worries me

20:58 because I feel like we don't know what we don't know with

21:01 that stuff. And they're copying little

21:02 knocks here and there a lot of weeks.

21:04 What does that mean? What does that accumulate to?

21:07 We don't actually know. So yeah, I just found that one a

21:10 really fascinating one to research.

21:12 Yeah, yeah, well, such different ones I remember.

21:15 And Pete also said he liked the Ashley Madison one too.

21:18 Yeah, that's. Another one of our it didn't

21:20 like has been has like lower views or lower listen.

21:24 Yes, yeah. But again, it's not the lighter

21:27 one. I mean, yeah, it wasn't

21:28 technically death in that one. No.

21:30 Well, there was. There wasn't like.

21:34 Murder. Yeah, he's like, I like any of

21:37 the ones that don't involve the murder of children.

21:39 I'm like, yeah, fair. Yeah, well, they're completely

21:42 fair. Yeah, completely fair.

21:43 They are definitely the tough ones.

21:44 Yeah, yeah, yeah. So good.

21:48 Today's though. Oh, this is a bit fun.

21:51 It's a bit. Fun.

21:53 All right, let's get going. We're gonna get into it, yes.

21:56 All right, so Martha Helen Stewart was born Martha Helen

22:02 Kostura on the 3rd of August in 1941.

22:06 We all know her as an American retail businesswoman, a writer,

22:11 ATV personality, and a convicted felon.

22:16 She was born in Jersey City, NJ and was the second of six

22:20 children to her parents, Martha. So her mom was Martha as well

22:23 and her father Edward Costera. They were both of Polish

22:27 heritage and Martha and her siblings were first generation

22:32 Americans. Both of her parents were very

22:36 well educated. They were both teachers and even

22:40 though they began their careers in that profession, as soon as

22:43 her mum had children, as was the era, she stopped work and became

22:48 a a homemaker. And I mean with six children.

22:51 Oh yeah, As if you'd be able to hold down a full time job at the

22:54 same time, no. A lot of Martha's take on that

22:57 later on, 'cause I mean, she only had one child herself, but

22:59 but she did say like, you know, well, you know, back then in the

23:01 day, you know, if you, you're struggling to look after the

23:03 children, you just have another one to look after the other

23:05 children fairly. Was that easy?

23:08 Fine. But I do find that comment

23:10 really interesting because she was the second eldest.

23:13 Yes. So she would have like been in

23:14 that role, although. Expectation was that she would,

23:18 yeah, that she would take on care of her, her youngest

23:21 siblings. Yeah, although her dad saw her

23:23 as being the most like him and really did take, take take her

23:27 under his wing a lot. And so she had quite a strong

23:31 relationship with him. He was very, very firm person,

23:34 very strict by the sounds of things.

23:36 Yeah, to the and particularly to the other children.

23:38 But she, she was his favorite. Yeah.

23:40 Yeah, because she. Well, she says that because he

23:44 was an absolute perfectionist. Yeah.

23:46 And she was a perfectionist by nature.

23:48 That was perfectly perfect. Yes, we hear that a lot.

23:52 Yeah. And yeah.

23:54 So I guess he saw in her what he liked about himself or what he

23:58 valued in himself and really took her under his wing.

24:03 And but he also expected perfection of her, but he also

24:07 then expected perfection of all of the children, all of his

24:10 children. Yeah, Martha was able to rise to

24:12 that occasion. So she was very much she.

24:16 Yeah, as you said, she was perfect, you know, in every way

24:19 she could be. And that's how she's lived her

24:21 entire life in some ways in until she was convicted, I

24:24 guess. Yeah.

24:25 Yeah, she at the age of 10, she was cooking family meals.

24:32 And I'm talking like elaborate family meals.

24:34 Her mum taught her how to cook and sew and her dad taught her

24:37 how to garden and and all of those things were very, very

24:40 important to her. The gardening thing was

24:42 interesting that all the other siblings, they were interviewed

24:45 in particular when I was looking at and they all hate gardening

24:48 now because he was so like belligerent around like how they

24:51 had to look after the garden because what they would do is

24:53 they would grow all because they weren't, they weren't wealthy,

24:55 no by any means. And they would grow all of their

24:58 produce and then what they couldn't grow in their garden,

25:00 they would then trade what they had with others to get what get

25:02 other food. So they they were very

25:05 resourceful and but it was so strict on how the kids were to

25:10 take care of that garden that they all now hate gardening.

25:13 Whereas Martha, how does she love to garden?

25:17 Did you watch the Netflix documentary about Martha?

25:20 Yeah, about Martha Stewart. It's really worth a watch.

25:22 It goes for a couple of hours, but it's it is really worth a

25:25 watch because in it you can see how she now as an, you know, 70

25:29 odd year old woman. Oh, eighties, 80s.

25:31 Yeah. How she treats the people who

25:34 now tend her garden like she treats them the way her father,

25:37 I'm sure, treated her. Yeah.

25:39 You know, she was telling one of her.

25:40 I'm gonna call him her subordinate because the way that

25:43 she spoke to him was just disgusting.

25:44 Yeah. But she was like, you need to

25:46 trim that back better. And you know how to.

25:48 You need to prune that hard. That's gotta, you know, survive

25:51 over the winter and you know, this person was just trying to

25:53 do their best. But no.

25:55 And she she says she's like, I don't I will never turn my back

25:58 to something. No, if I don't think it's right,

26:00 I will make it right. And.

26:02 Look, I can. Respect that, but to to be an

26:06 asshole. I know there's there's

26:07 certainly. A nice way to do things.

26:10 I mean, I'm sure she's got very high turnover of of her stuff.

26:13 Yeah, what about in the documentary?

26:16 I know this is probably jumping way far ahead now, but she has a

26:19 go at one of her sous chefs for using the wrong knife to cut an

26:22 orange. She's like, you shouldn't be

26:25 using that little knife she was using.

26:27 It uses a little knife to cut things.

26:28 You need a big knife, Yeah. But flee and then she told the

26:32 camera to turn. Told the the film team to turn

26:35 the camera off because she knew she was being an arsehole.

26:36 She was gonna be even more of an arsehole, yeah.

26:39 Yeah, I'm like, come on, Martha, You've had, you've been brought

26:42 up like this. But she's a very interesting

26:44 personality and she's very interesting.

26:47 I would love to know whether she has a diagnosis.

26:51 Nah, going around undiagnosed. I'd say I well, because yes,

26:57 yes, she's yes, there's certainly nothing out in in the

27:01 open. But no, you watch that

27:03 documentary and you think, oh. And that documentary was like, I

27:06 mean, she fully takes part in that documentary.

27:08 She's oh, it was, it's her perspective, her perspective.

27:10 So I mean, because I'm, I was watching it kind of going,

27:13 there's certain things in that way.

27:14 And because in my research, I have to admit it, it go to some

27:17 places and the information was not accurate.

27:19 And I'm like, yeah, because someone's come in and and wiped

27:21 that information because you have to go to the right places

27:24 to get the right information on her because she's far reaching.

27:27 And so she's got some. Like there's some stuff to

27:29 support her all the way. Absolutely.

27:33 So that documentary, you do have to kind of at points of it, kind

27:35 of go, did you? Yeah.

27:39 But did you say that? But her true colors do shine

27:41 through too. So you can watch it and get the

27:43 whole picture really. So I think it was a book very

27:46 well done. Yeah.

27:48 At 8:00. So her father then finished

27:51 teaching and he became a pharmaceutical salesman.

27:54 And Martha said that he was way too smart for that job.

27:57 He was bored in that job. He never progressed because it

27:59 wasn't challenging enough for him.

28:01 And it was sort of a means to an end.

28:04 And I mean, the fact that she sees that in him and he was

28:10 unable to do anything else, I don't know.

28:12 It was it was a bit sad. It's.

28:13 Interesting. I wonder that whether that's

28:14 what he told her, you know, and that was that's him like, you

28:17 know, the language coming out of like, you know, I'm better than

28:19 this. I don't need, you know what I

28:20 mean? Like I wonder that's.

28:21 But then she feels, she feels like she's better than a lot of.

28:23 Things exactly. Yeah, so.

28:25 It's a it's a whole attitude. At age 10, she was babysitting

28:29 for New York Yankees players, kids.

28:32 So they met through neighbors and in the neighborhood, and she

28:37 ended up at 10 years of age, babysitting children.

28:40 Was that? Was it Mickey Mantle?

28:43 It had four boys, and she would babysit them and plan their

28:46 birthday parties and do all those sorts of things that, I

28:48 mean, I'm not aufait with the New York Yankees and who the

28:51 players are. I have heard of that name, Yeah.

28:54 There were a few other names bandied about and I'm like, I've

28:57 no. Idea.

28:57 I don't know who they are. She would get paid $0.50 an hour

29:01 for babysitting back then, Yes. They lived across the road from

29:06 a girl who had a mum, mum and daughter.

29:08 And the daughter was quite a successful model.

29:11 Yes. And the mum said to Martha one

29:13 day, well, you're pretty enough, do you want me to introduce you

29:15 to the agency? And she was like, oh, well,

29:17 yeah, why not give it a go? So I think it around aged 15,

29:20 yeah. She became a model.

29:22 Her first ever television commercial was for Unilever for

29:26 Roland deodorant. Wow, that's amazing.

29:30 Yeah, yeah. It would have been the new

29:32 fandangled thing, because in. Black and white, the ad and she,

29:35 I mean she, she is beautiful. Oh she's so gorgeous the her

29:40 modelling photos, that's stunning.

29:42 Absolutely stunning. She even modelled at the age of

29:45 15, modelled for Chanel. Chanel.

29:46 She. Was doing luxury brands right

29:48 from the get go. Yeah.

29:49 And she thought it was fantastic because she earned $15.00 an

29:52 hour. Yeah, that was a lot.

29:53 Of money, she was a lot of money and she said she ended up having

29:56 to give a lot of the money back to her mum to pay for her

30:00 siblings and just for food because they were really

30:02 struggling to make ends meet at that time.

30:05 But that. $15.00 an hour was that was a lot of money to be

30:07 earning. So I mean amazing.

30:09 Especially at age 15. Crazy, but she did the modelling

30:13 right through her her university days as well.

30:16 So she did did catwalks and things like that.

30:18 But she did a lot of a lot of print magazine and things like

30:21 as well and adverts, but so it was so varied.

30:24 She really did was able to do it all.

30:25 And she she says like she wasn't a supermodel, she wasn't to that

30:28 level, but she certainly did some.

30:31 I just say very top notch brands and in at very, I mean the

30:35 photos are just incredible. I I think they're stunning.

30:38 Absolutely stunning. Yeah.

30:39 She did a lot of editorials and that kind of thing.

30:41 Yeah. She used her modelling money to

30:44 supplement her college tuition. So she did get a scholarship to

30:50 one of the most prestigious schools within Columbia

30:53 University. And it was she went to.

30:58 It was a Business School, wasn't it?

31:00 And actually got her degree in history in architectural

31:04 history, History I. Believe it was like the actual

31:07 school was like a business type school, right?

31:10 And she did incredibly well. There very well.

31:13 She's very intelligent. Very, very intelligent.

31:16 She tells the story of one of her classmates at the school

31:20 would roll up in a Rolls Royce every day with a driver.

31:23 Oh, wow. And this lady, this girl she

31:25 became sort of acquaintances with, and she ended up coming

31:32 over to Martha one day and saying, well, I've got a

31:34 brother, and I think you 2 should go out on a date.

31:37 Yeah. And so they did.

31:41 So she, at that time, she went out with Andrew Stewart.

31:45 His name was Andy. She called him.

31:48 And he was actually studying a law degree at Yale at the time

31:53 they met and felt. She said she fell in love with

31:56 him at the 1st dinner that they had together.

31:59 Yeah. They, their first date, he

32:01 picked her up, she said, in a yellow Mercedes-Benz.

32:04 And she'd never been in a Mercedes before, So she thought

32:06 that was amazing. Yeah.

32:08 And then he paid for dinner with a black American Express credit

32:11 card. And again, she said, like, only

32:14 like that was unheard of. You know that only the.

32:16 Elite. So did she fall in love with him

32:18 or his? Mother, well, she, she said he

32:20 was very kind. He, she was the anti.

32:22 Sorry, he was the anti of her father.

32:25 So he was gentle, he was kind, he was engaging.

32:28 But he said that's not how. Like, that's not how her dad was

32:30 described though, is it? No, and it's interesting.

32:33 It's not how she describes Andrew by the end of their

32:35 marriage. Not by the end of their

32:36 marriage, no. But she what she's saying is

32:38 like his her her dad at this time, her dad.

32:41 Yeah. And Andrew was so at opposite.

32:43 Oh, right, sorry, I. Misheard.

32:45 Yeah, they were at opposite ends of the spectrum.

32:47 So she really fell for his gentle, caring, kind nature.

32:51 Yeah, right. She loved him.

32:54 Hard, yeah. Really, really hard.

32:56 And she said, well, you know, at that, in that day and age, what

33:00 were we to do? We'd fallen in love.

33:02 Of course. We got married.

33:03 Yeah. So in July of 1961, that's

33:05 exactly what they did. They got married and they

33:09 started their life together. They went on a six month.

33:13 Honeymoon and the honeymoon sounded amazing.

33:16 Oh my God, yeah. I mean, she, she fell in love

33:18 again, I think with doing that too.

33:19 I fell in love with travel. She fell in love with the

33:22 cuisine that she was, you know, because America, I mean, even to

33:25 this day that, you know, American food, they're, you know

33:27 what they're, they're, I guess national food is it's very quite

33:30 bland, I guess, in terms of like what European Food brings to the

33:33 table of Italian foods and things like that.

33:36 Yeah. And she was, she paid such close

33:37 attention to all the the French cooks and the Italian cooks and

33:41 how they were doing everything over there that she was

33:43 fascinated by how they they presented their foods and how it

33:46 was all so lush. And yeah, so.

33:49 She kept a diary every single day, pretty much every single

33:53 day of her life, but in particular every single day when

33:55 they were away on this honeymoon.

33:57 Yeah. And she wrote down everything

33:58 they ate, how much it cost. Yeah.

34:00 And what they did and where they went and everything.

34:03 It's so, so detailed. You can see photos of certain

34:07 pages that she's. She's allowed to.

34:10 She has allowed to be released to the public.

34:12 Yeah. It's fascinating.

34:13 Oh, and she says that, you know, that's, and she decided that

34:16 really in her life, if she could do looking at the buildings like

34:20 that and, you know, and the foods and everything, if she

34:23 could make a life for herself out of looking and doing those

34:27 things for the rest of her life, she would lead an incredible

34:30 life. She was.

34:30 And she would never work a day in her life.

34:32 You know, she was willing to work as hard as she could to

34:36 have that in her life. Yeah.

34:39 She's fascinated. She's a really interesting human

34:42 being. So they're on their honeymoon

34:44 and she was a little bit religious.

34:48 She doesn't say she was like, you know, all, all or nothing.

34:51 But Andrew, Andy wasn't at all. And when they were in Italy, she

34:56 decided to go to the Duomo and he didn't want to go with her.

34:59 So she actually went there. And she said she had almost a

35:02 bit of a transformative experience when she was there

35:06 and the grandeur of it. And I mean, I guess, you know,

35:09 you'd read, read about it in books, You'd seen photos of it.

35:13 And it really she became sort of almost overwhelmed.

35:16 And the way she talks about it is really fascinating because

35:19 she talks about it like it was a transformative day in her life

35:24 to be in this place. And she ended up kissing a man

35:28 like she wanted to, a random, she wanted to, I don't know,

35:32 mark the occasion in some way or make it grand in some way or

35:35 memorable or something. And so she decided to like

35:39 Andrew. Andy's back at the hotel,

35:41 waiting for. Her my new husband.

35:42 Yeah, and she's off passion, but she goes, oh, it didn't mean

35:45 anything. No, it didn't mean anything.

35:48 It was just a kiss. Didn't mean anything.

35:51 Really, really unusual, yeah. Because she's.

35:53 But then she says staunchly, I never cheated on Andrew.

35:56 No, she doesn't see it as that at all.

35:58 I mean I. Don't know.

35:59 I mean a kiss. OK, a kiss is a kiss, but.

36:01 But why would you want to seek that out?

36:03 What was on your honeymoon? Please, I don't really

36:06 understand. Yeah, I don't get it.

36:08 I really I couldn't even though she explained it and I could

36:11 feel that she felt that. Like, yeah, yeah.

36:13 Oh yeah. She really?

36:14 Felt the moment. Like there was nothing in her

36:16 that you could say, you know, Like, I don't know, she was very

36:18 staunch in her idea. No, she was, of course.

36:21 That's how. Yeah.

36:22 Why don't you accept that like? Yeah, she's, she's so bloody

36:25 fascinating. Yeah.

36:27 In 1967, she began working as a stockbroker because her

36:31 father-in-law was a stockbroker. And she looked at what he did

36:34 and went, Oh yeah, I reckon I could do that.

36:35 Well, he introduced her to some people and said she's a really

36:38 intelligent woman. Take her undo wing like.

36:41 And she she did good at it. Yeah, for a while.

36:43 Yeah, she was really. They were very impressed with

36:45 her. She was.

36:46 I mean, she was probably, I think she was the only woman in

36:49 the in that company that she was working for.

36:51 Yeah, especially at that to that, you know, probably plenty

36:53 of assistants and typists unfortunately being women.

36:56 But but I was doing the stockbroking.

36:58 No, like they weren't women doing that.

37:00 Yeah, and she was a mother by that stage too, because on the

37:02 27th of September in 1965, their daughter Alexis was born.

37:07 Yes, Lexi, they call her. And yeah, so she's gone back to

37:12 work a couple of years later as in a brand new career.

37:15 Like, hats off to her. She was a bit of a trailblazer

37:17 in that respect, wasn't? She she used to go to.

37:20 Work in the most beautiful suits.

37:22 She looked always immaculately presented.

37:26 Yes. She didn't wear a lot of makeup,

37:28 but she always looked lovely. Yeah, like really neat and tidy.

37:32 Always dressed beautifully. Simple but classy.

37:36 Yeah, very classy for sure. Andrew founded a publishing

37:40 house and served as CEO on several boards for other

37:43 publishing houses. So that ended up becoming his

37:45 bread and butter. Yeah, despite the fact that he

37:46 was a lawyer by by trade. Yes.

37:49 And the publishing house that he started was amazing.

37:54 Like it grew and grew and grew and it was an incredibly

37:57 successful. Company, It's one of the biggest

37:59 in America. Yeah, yeah, she says so sorry,

38:03 actually. And around this time, they

38:05 bought a farmhouse in Connecticut.

38:08 Yeah, it was an old farmhouse. It was built in 1805, and it was

38:13 trash. Like it was the worst house on

38:15 the best St. So it was on Turkey Hill Rd.

38:18 Yeah, we're sorry. Later on this farmhouse when it

38:20 was renovated, everything was absolutely stunning and it

38:23 became known as just Turkey Hill.

38:25 Like so it was on Turkey Hill Rd. but this place just became

38:28 Turkey Hill. It's just amazing what they did

38:31 with it. It was Martha really did all of

38:35 the interior design decoration. She was basically.

38:40 She was in her heaven doing that.

38:42 That was really what she loved doing.

38:44 And I mean. She's.

38:44 Got that package, the renovating of that house going on a very

38:47 young child and she's a stock broker and in the background of

38:52 all of that she then begin, Oh well, let's go back a little

38:54 bit. The stock broking she they hit a

38:57 bit of a an issue that she did lose a bit of money and they did

39:01 lose a lot of her clients lost a fair bit of money.

39:03 Not her fault by the way the stock market goes.

39:06 That was something that they purchased they thought was going

39:08 to do well didn't, but she did take that pretty hard of how

39:11 that had occurred. So she did sort of step back

39:14 from it and sort of want to get out, I think, and that was when

39:16 she started her next venture with it was a model friend of

39:21 hers, Norma Collier. They met modelling and they

39:24 started their catering business by the name of the Uncatered

39:30 Affair. Yeah.

39:31 And I just love this business model.

39:33 Yeah. They were very smart girls.

39:36 Very. They had literally tapped into

39:38 such a successful, you know, bit of market here.

39:41 So it was that time of women, you know, doing that.

39:44 They were, they were homemakers meant to be, you know,

39:46 homemakers have everything perfect at home, perfectly

39:48 perfect. But they're also supposed to be

39:51 out of the home working at the same time.

39:53 So to juggle all of that is just it's impossible.

39:56 So this is where these women would step in.

39:58 And so they would still, these women would not have these

40:00 lavish, you know, dinner parties that they would have for their

40:03 family and friends and things. And so Martha and her friend

40:07 would cater these events, but secretly, and so that the women

40:12 could then present it as if they had done all the hard work, not

40:14 the catering company. And make out as if, Oh yes, I've

40:17 just been slaving around the kitchen all day and I still look

40:19 amazing and yeah, and I've worked all day, but here you go.

40:22 Here's your three course meal that I've I've just prepared

40:26 earlier and then some. It was unbelievable the

40:28 lavishness of these things that they would present.

40:30 And I mean, some of these dinner parties, they started out small,

40:33 but grew and grew and grew. They ended up catering an event

40:37 at the Guggenheim for like 70,000 no 7000. 7000 people you

40:42 also, I mean the partnership didn't last all that long

40:46 between the two of them because what Norma has said is that she

40:49 was really happy doing the ten 20-30 people dinners, whereas

40:54 Martha wasn't happy unless there was a unless there was 1000

40:57 guests at the party they were catering so.

40:59 They had different. Ideas, very different ideas of

41:01 what they were doing, which I I thought back and go, why can't

41:04 you do both? Yeah.

41:06 Two arms of the two. Arms of the same business but

41:08 apparently Norma walked in on Martha talking to Andrew saying

41:12 you know I should be taking more money because I do more work,

41:16 which possibly she was if she was wanting to run these

41:19 thousand, you know, guest parties whereas Norma was saying

41:22 well no, I want to do this 20 or 30 yeah, so maybe she was

41:25 putting in more work but a partnership's a partnership and,

41:29 you know take on the work you take on don't you Yeah, well.

41:31 That's it. Yeah, she it I I found.

41:35 I mean, they're parting of ways. I don't think it was bad bad.

41:38 Oh, I don't think it was amicable either though.

41:40 Yeah, but I don't, I don't know it wasn't.

41:42 Catastrophic or? Anything like that I guess.

41:44 I mean, being in that friendship would have been pretty awkward.

41:46 Yeah. Well, I think honestly, I mean,

41:48 I think that obviously Norma didn't have the ambition that

41:52 Martha had. I mean, I don't know if anyone

41:54 would have the amount of ambition that Martha had.

41:57 She'd wear anyone. Yeah.

41:59 Absolutely unequaled. Yeah, yeah, she's yeah.

42:03 The business grew and grew and grew and it really then started

42:07 to morph into into lots of. Well, yeah, other things.

42:11 One of the guest at the party who knew Andrew and also Martha

42:14 said to her one day what, you should have a cookbook.

42:18 And at the time she responded, which I think very smart.

42:20 Again, she's very intelligent. One thing she said was, well, I

42:23 don't want Andrew's business publishing it.

42:25 Yep, That would be nepotism. She really stepped away and

42:29 didn't like that idea. But also she's I'm not ready.

42:32 She was like, yes, good. I've already probably already

42:35 thought of that. Yeah, but I'm not ready yet.

42:38 And so she didn't release her first book for another 12 months

42:41 after that being suggested to her.

42:43 But the first book she did release was called Entertaining.

42:48 It's called entertaining. What she said when she was

42:50 writing that was that she wanted it to not just be a cookbook.

42:54 Yeah. She wanted it to be about the

42:55 whole experience. So how to set the table nicely,

42:58 how to do a floral arrangement, Yeah.

43:01 You know, different kinds of centrepieces and all of those

43:03 kinds of things. And so.

43:05 And she wanted also some anecdotes and stories that she'd

43:08 written. So this really set the stage for

43:11 what then became a really prolific, well, book writing

43:14 career. Yeah, so 1982 she released that

43:17 book. OK, so this day she just not

43:19 long ago released her 100th book.

43:23 Unbelievable. She pretty much released like

43:25 more than one book. Well, more than one book a year.

43:27 From now, she said, at the prime of it, her publisher expected

43:31 more than one book a year. Yeah, it was.

43:33 It was an expectation. So she released books like

43:35 crazy. Martha Stewart Hors d'oeuvres,

43:37 you know. Martha Stewart Christmas Martha

43:41 Stewart. Wreaths.

43:42 Yes, Yeah. I mean, at some point, maybe

43:47 scraping the bottom of the barrel, but she also said that

43:49 she had so much to say that this is where it morphed into

43:53 magazines for her and like monthly publications because

43:57 she, I guess a cookbook or a book that you're writing can be

44:00 quite limited. You've got probably got a

44:02 limited number of pages you're allowed to keep to.

44:04 There'd be a format that you have to, you know, make sure

44:07 you're kind of fitting into. You've got to keep your

44:10 publisher happy. But she was like, well, no, I

44:12 actually have got so many more things that I want to say.

44:14 Like she was a Blogger before blogging was a.

44:17 This is it and. So she needed a medium to do

44:20 that. I'm going to start my own

44:22 magazine. So Time magazine, Time, you

44:26 know, the Time magazine publishing company took her on

44:30 and started the Martha Stewart Living magazine.

44:35 And she was, you know, you think somebody puts in somebody like

44:39 Martha Stewart puts their name to something.

44:41 They'd be ghost writers. And look, there were a lot of

44:43 people who contributed monthly to all of the magazines she

44:46 ended up producing, but she was still at the forefront of all of

44:51 it. She planned them.

44:52 She wrote articles. She.

44:54 She was on the front cover. She was pretty much every

44:55 single. One, yeah, she she guided all of

44:59 the content because she was an absolute control freak.

45:02 Yep. Absolute.

45:04 Just say it quietly, yeah? Andrew, her husband said.

45:08 She was controlling and an absolute perfectionist.

45:12 And she was. Yeah.

45:14 But that led to her success because look at where she was

45:18 after all that. Absolutely.

45:20 It was incredible. She obviously was at this time

45:24 as well. She was starting to make more

45:25 and more TV appearances. Her name was becoming a

45:28 household name. Yeah.

45:30 And all of her homewares and that kind of thing that, you

45:33 know, she would show in her magazines.

45:35 People wanted that. They looked at her life and they

45:38 wanted what she had. Yeah.

45:40 So they. She then ended up partnering

45:43 with Kmart. This blew my mind when I heard

45:46 about this. So she blew she she did a deal

45:50 with Kmart to sell. She did a lot of Manchester

45:53 homewares and you know that, that sort of thing.

45:57 Yeah. Now, Kmart's You know about a

45:59 bargain basement type. Particularly in America.

46:02 Especially in America and especially back then, yeah, it

46:05 wasn't. Kmart wasn't what it is.

46:07 Well, it's still not in America what it is here.

46:09 Yeah. Like it's, yeah, it is very much

46:12 low level. But she said she wanted

46:14 everybody to be able to walk into a home and feel nice about

46:17 the things that they had. But she's always.

46:19 Picked on a bit like she never actually bought the stuff or

46:21 never. Like not that you have to buy

46:22 it, but like, yeah, she wouldn't have.

46:24 She didn't. Have stuff because the highest

46:26 thread count that the sheets that she sold in Kmart was 250

46:29 should be 1000 thread count minimum on a bad day when all

46:35 the other linens in the box yeah now just a few stats on the

46:41 Kmart because I was really fascinated by the money because

46:45 I'm like what else would have driven her to go down that path

46:48 so. Of course, money.

46:50 In the US alone, 77 million shoppers shopped at Kmart every

46:57 month and upon release of her Martha Stewart Living range to

47:02 Kmart added $70 million to her bottom line.

47:08 So profit $70 million annually? Yeah, just from putting her shit

47:14 in Kmart. So do you know that there was

47:16 one point where Kmart we're gonna sell their company, right?

47:21 And she wanted to buy it. And, you know, her idea was was

47:25 to buy Kmart and rebrand it Kmarta.

47:32 That's out of her own mouth. I love it.

47:35 I'd shop at Kmarta. Yeah, I mean, stuff is

47:40 beautiful. Oh, this is.

47:41 It I actually do have a Martha Stewart photo frame.

47:43 Oh yeah, I got it. I got given up for our wedding

47:46 and I've got one of our wedding photos in it and it's very

47:48 beautiful it. Came Martha for Beautiful, I

47:50 reckon. Came Artha for the win.

47:52 Yeah, she also in one of the interviews I was watching, she

47:55 she's, she loves herself. Oh, yeah.

47:59 She they were like, oh, tell us. Oh actually no, sorry, she did

48:03 an interview. This is heading more towards

48:05 Snoop Dogg territory. Now, but she was doing.

48:07 One of those late night shows with I think Colbert, maybe.

48:10 Yeah. And she and Snoop were on there.

48:12 I think it must have been during COVID because they were both

48:14 remote and they were, they had to answer questions.

48:17 It was like, how well do you know your bestie?

48:19 And so they said, oh, what's what's your favorite drink?

48:23 And Snoop Dogg wrote vodka for Martha, right?

48:26 Martha wrote a Martha teeny or a Yeah, a Martha teeny.

48:32 I'm like, you can't even have a fucking martini.

48:33 No, it has to be a martini. And then I Googled it and I'm

48:37 like, did she make up a drink? But there was no recipe for a

48:40 martini. It was just a martini.

48:41 Well, Snoop Dogg knows the recipe, obviously.

48:46 I want one. Yeah, I think it's just some

48:49 spice in that. So around this time as well,

48:56 Martha discovered that Andy had been having multiple affairs.

49:00 Now she her claim is that he was having affairs.

49:04 She thinks throughout their whole marriage.

49:07 He says he didn't and that he only had an affair after she had

49:11 an affair, even though she said she never had an affair.

49:14 But then she also says she did have a relationship with

49:17 someone. That's not an affair.

49:19 Just not an affair. It was different because she

49:21 didn't care, whereas whereas Andy cared, he cared about his.

49:26 Girlfriend. So that's a very interesting

49:27 take, isn't it? But she.

49:29 Didn't care. She, she, she said.

49:31 I only had an affair. He was a young, very attractive

49:34 Irish man. I mean, I get that.

49:37 Well, I do love an Irish accent. But it wasn't an affair because

49:44 she didn't. Care about it.

49:44 She didn't care about him. He just looked nice.

49:47 Yeah. And it only happened once.

49:51 I love and hate her all. At once, I know, I know.

49:53 She's such an enigma. She's yeah.

49:55 She's like, yeah, it's conf. How do you argue?

49:58 We don't even. Know.

49:59 Well, I don't know, but she said Andrew, Andy really cared about

50:03 the women he had affairs with and he would buy them things and

50:06 and he also actually brought a couple of them into their house.

50:09 Yeah. And then he had an affair with

50:11 one of Martha's. So she was, this lady was

50:15 Martha's florist, and then she lost her house.

50:19 Her personal florist. Yeah, her personal florist.

50:21 She had a floristry room in her house.

50:24 Like this room was probably triple the size of my.

50:29 No, in fact, probably the size of my kitchen.

50:32 And it was just. All just it was a giant through

50:36 and all, like thousands of vases along the walls and.

50:40 So your dream? Oh, it would be Oh.

50:43 My God, I mean, there are probably a million things I'd

50:46 want ahead of a floristry room or that I could use that space

50:51 for. But like, this is the opulence.

50:53 Yeah, you know, the nature. And she had her personal florist

50:55 who would daily pick. Flowers.

50:57 Pick flowers. And rotate the flowers within

51:00 the house. And anyway, so she came upon a

51:03 hard time, not quite sure what happened, but she lost her house

51:06 and Andy and Martha had several guest cottages on their

51:09 property. Several guest cottages.

51:10 For all guest cottages, I wouldn't mind a trot on a guest

51:14 cottage from Martha. And Martha came home one day, I

51:19 think she'd been away for business, and she came home and

51:22 Andy was in bed with the florist in the guest house.

51:25 Oh, oh, oh, that's bad, Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

51:31 So Needless to say, well, she she actually says she wouldn't

51:34 have divorced him. No, no, no, but I feel like that

51:37 was all around perception from other people because you know,

51:41 like her whole brand was that she was homemaker, everything

51:45 perfectly perfect. You can't get divorced and not

51:49 have your marriage work if you're perfectly perfect.

51:52 True. That's why she didn't want to

51:55 divorce him. Yeah, No, she and she did very.

51:58 She fought really hard. She was like she wrote him

52:00 letters after letter. After letters were in OH.

52:03 My God. And the things she's like, why

52:05 are we not just working this out?

52:07 Why are we not? I don't think he wants to.

52:10 Oh no. He he pushed for the divorce.

52:13 Yeah, he was. Well, he was done.

52:14 I think she was. I think she was awful to him.

52:18 He says that he. Says yeah, he he has said that.

52:20 Probably he has said that she was really difficult to live

52:23 with. Nothing he ever did was good

52:26 enough. Well, she was a harder She had a

52:28 business to run on him. Like on his back about

52:31 something. Yeah.

52:32 Apparently, no matter where they went or what they did, he never

52:35 wore the right clothes. You know?

52:37 He just couldn't do anything right and she was always just

52:41 hyper, hyper critical of him. Yeah.

52:44 And if you wanna get all the dirt on that stuff, there's the

52:46 unauthorised biography that was released, yes, 1998.

52:49 It was called Just Desserts. I love that.

52:53 And in that all the disgruntled ex employees and all that sort

52:56 of stuff who saw all this stuff going down between the two of

52:59 them, they all come out to play in that and.

53:01 And they all have very similar accounts of what they saw like.

53:04 It's not like no one's like, not one.

53:05 So not one just random person who's a bit, you know,

53:07 disgruntled around their employment or or lack thereof

53:10 now or something. Yeah.

53:12 There's many people who've come out and back stories and things

53:15 that of how awful she was or is to people.

53:19 Yeah. Oh, still is.

53:20 Yeah, to this day, But at this time in 1998 when that book was

53:23 released, like it's, yeah, a lot of people.

53:25 And so I can see this whole marriage situation from both

53:29 sides. Yeah.

53:30 I think he wanted out. And he was like, come on, like,

53:31 I'll freaking have. I'll have an affair right in

53:33 front of your face. And then maybe you'll like, let

53:35 me go where And she was, well, no, this is the brand.

53:39 You can't leave. But then the the what she

53:44 thought was going to happen, or what she thought the fallout was

53:47 going to be from the breakup of their marriage didn't.

53:49 Didn't because no one gave a shit because.

53:51 We've all moved on like as a society, we've moved on from

53:54 that. That's what, you know, you have

53:56 to be married for this to be perfectly perfect.

53:58 Yeah. So she.

54:00 And it wasn't like at that stage, like Lexie was little

54:02 she, you know, she was growing up by then too.

54:05 So like, let the marriage go. I think they.

54:07 Were married for 20 something years 25.

54:09 Years. Oh, at least they didn't get

54:10 They were separated in 1987, and they finally actually divorced

54:13 in 1990. OK, Yeah, yeah.

54:16 So they they were married for a very long time.

54:18 They were, yeah. Well, you know, these things

54:22 must come to an end. But she did then start dating a

54:27 man by the name of Charles Simonyi.

54:29 Yes. Oh wow, isn't this an

54:31 interesting little relationship? So her she actually says that

54:38 she liked men who thought and did, but not men who had

54:42 feelings, no. Which says a lot.

54:45 Says a lot. She wants to be busy and she

54:47 needs her man to be busy and she needs to be able to think, yeah.

54:50 And be able to keep up with her and keep up with her.

54:53 Conversation. I don't know how anyone can keep

54:54 up with her I. Don't know either.

54:56 No. It'd be exhausting to be around.

54:57 She's always got something on the go.

54:59 Oh yeah, Well, I mean kind. Of a bit manic.

55:01 Yeah, their relationship was interesting in that it wasn't

55:04 really defined as such, but when they did break up, she did call

55:08 it her second divorce. Yes, but The thing is it wasn't

55:12 defined and she never sought the definition.

55:14 But she obviously felt something that he like.

55:17 He just never gave her what she wanted.

55:19 I. Don't know.

55:20 I mean behind closed doors, who knows?

55:22 But publicly it was never they would they?

55:25 They would go everywhere, but they were never.

55:26 Officially a couple. No, they they well, not

55:29 publicly. Yeah, no, like it's but she'll

55:31 she's even said like, oh, had I've had many men that I've just

55:34 never spoken of. Yeah, like give us the list,

55:37 Martha. I would love to know so this

55:41 Charles Simonier, he was one of the engineers who developed

55:45 Microsoft. Word and.

55:46 Microsoft Excel. He was incredibly intelligent,

55:49 and because of what he had a hand in creating, he was

55:53 incredibly wealthy. Like Martha was coming up for

55:57 being really wealthy throughout this time because her magazines

56:00 were taking off. TV show.

56:02 TV show. She obviously had a Kmart brand

56:05 deal and all of that sort of stuff, so she was doing very

56:08 well for herself. Yeah, he was another level.

56:10 He had his own, like owned his own private jet.

56:13 Yes, it was another level of filthy wealth.

56:17 Like filthy much filthy wealth, yes.

56:20 Yeah, so, but their, their relationship was pretty bloody

56:24 complicated, I think. And with Martha, I don't know.

56:28 I don't know what level you would have a connection with her

56:32 on, to be honest. It's, she was very much about

56:34 her and about what she thought and about what she wanted.

56:37 And yeah. So in December of 2001, she,

56:43 well, she had a friend and she met this friend.

56:45 Oh, hang on. Just, sorry, go back one little

56:47 step. Yeah, because it was in 1997

56:50 that the that her company. So she heard she had a Margaret

56:54 Stewart Living. Omni Media.

56:56 Stewart. Yep, so that that whole company

56:59 became went public. Oh yes, on the Stock Exchange.

57:02 So in 1997, which that when it did that, that's when she

57:06 clicked over as being the first ever made self-made female

57:10 billionaire in, in the, in the US.

57:13 So that's huge. I mean, she's bigger than

57:16 anything. She's absolute powerhouse.

57:18 And that's so that's beyond, that's past her, you know, her

57:21 divorce from her husband. She's this business has

57:24 continued on. And you know, as we said, didn't

57:26 it didn't even miss a beat with all that.

57:27 As much as she thought it was going to destroy her, it didn't.

57:31 And yeah, went on to strength and strength.

57:32 So she her company was absolutely flying at this point.

57:36 So late 90s, going into the 2000s, she was everywhere,

57:40 Everywhere, absolutely every, I mean, I mean publicly in terms

57:43 of like, you know, the every list of like any celebrities and

57:46 things. She was there.

57:48 Any party, she was there. Yeah, if, if no company was, you

57:51 know, catering or something. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

57:53 She was on the board of the of the New York Stock Exchange,

57:56 Yes. And she was on the board of

57:58 Revlon as well at this time. So very prestigious position,

58:02 yes. And you know, that just goes to

58:05 show the caliber of her business prowess.

58:09 She she is an incredible businesswoman, yes, very astute,

58:14 very switched on. I mean, she even the way she

58:17 talks about her life at that time when her, her company went

58:22 public, she, she did the IPO herself.

58:27 She she was just incredible. She learned she's just.

58:31 Amazing and and changed over these generations like these

58:34 decades that she's been doing this.

58:36 Is there anything? She can't do.

58:37 Oh no. Because you know, what she was

58:38 talking about recently was because she's got this so much

58:41 media of her out, like the magazines, the TV shows,

58:43 everything, right? So she's talking about now like

58:45 she wants to do AI, Martha AI, which I'm like, yeah, you

58:49 imagine what you could put into into Martha AI and come up with

58:52 because that thinking, I mean, well, I mean, you could cook a

58:56 main roast and get a great recipe and like whatever you

58:59 want out of that thing. There's the the amount of info

59:01 information that Martha Stewart has put out for the world.

59:05 Martha AI she. Can be her own little bot.

59:07 Bot. Yeah.

59:09 Oh yeah. She, she's just, she's amazing.

59:12 She's and she's, she's working on the tech like she's on in on

59:15 it. Oh, at 80, whatever years of

59:18 age, yeah, she just blows my mind.

59:20 Yeah. So she's obviously, I mean, the

59:22 fact that she was a stockbroker, she's always had shares traded

59:27 shares. That's been part of her

59:29 portfolio, her private portfolio.

59:32 And you know, she enlisted the the services of a man by the

59:39 name of Peter Bakanovic. Bakanovic, yeah.

59:43 And he was her stockbroker, her personal stockbroker.

59:47 And she wanted to buy some shares for Mklone so.

59:53 This was bad. You know how she met the guy for

59:55 Mklone though? Sam Waxall.

59:56 Yeah. How?

59:58 Oh. So.

1:00:00 Lexie was dating Sam. Oh, that's right.

1:00:03 Oh. Yes, that's right.

1:00:04 I know. I knew this.

1:00:05 OK. He's so old.

1:00:06 Oh so so this I'm talking they're dating like Lexie 24 and

1:00:10 he was 42 or something like that.

1:00:12 I feel like it wasn't. It could have been bigger gap

1:00:14 he. Might have been 40. 2 anyway,

1:00:16 anyway, it was a big gap. He she was closer in age to his

1:00:19 daughters, yes, than than him anyway, like it was a big age

1:00:23 gap. So they're dating right?

1:00:25 And and obviously she then introduces her mum because so at

1:00:28 this point Lexie is out about social scene.

1:00:31 She is social eating a bit right kind of stuff in the and she's

1:00:34 done very intelligent being to you know, it was at university

1:00:36 etcetera. But in those circles she was

1:00:38 travelling in some high level wealthy, wealthy families,

1:00:42 etcetera. Yeah, yeah.

1:00:43 Met Sam Waxall and was dating him.

1:00:46 They broke up, but Martha and Sam still hung out a lot.

1:00:53 Besties Do besties sleep together?

1:00:58 Well, not in our case. Well.

1:01:02 Been meaning to, Sir. Yeah, their relationship's

1:01:07 really interesting. Yeah, they were photographed

1:01:09 together. A.

1:01:10 Lot They've never admitted to having a relationship.

1:01:12 Let's just put it out publicly, but the speculation of that

1:01:16 relationship. In that in that book you were

1:01:19 referring to before the. Just desserts, yes.

1:01:22 Just desserts, they talk about that.

1:01:24 And he was there all the time. She was, Yeah.

1:01:27 I mean, they were. They were.

1:01:28 Yeah. Well.

1:01:31 Totally. So, yeah, that's how they met

1:01:34 and they obviously he was in, had his own company and that was

1:01:37 very interesting to her, I bet. But there are other things that

1:01:40 she was interested in, too. Yeah.

1:01:42 I mean, his, his company at the time was successful in that they

1:01:46 were developing a drug called, so they were a biotech company.

1:01:49 It's called inclone, IMCLONE. Yeah, Now we're developing a

1:01:53 drug, drug called Erbetux, which was a cancer treatment drug,

1:01:57 Martha says. In one of the documentaries I

1:01:59 was watching, she's like, it was it's going to be a cure for

1:02:01 cancer. Yeah, that's what they believed.

1:02:03 That's where they thought it was going.

1:02:04 Yeah. And so it was obviously

1:02:06 submitted after, I mean, this was years in the making, but

1:02:10 they submitted it to the FDA for approval.

1:02:13 Yeah. And a couple of days before it

1:02:15 was made public that the FDA approval wasn't going ahead,

1:02:20 Martha sold all of her shares. Yes, she did now.

1:02:26 She had about 1/4 of $1,000,000 worth of shares at the time.

1:02:31 They were worth about 50 grand more than what she'd bought them

1:02:34 for, so she was sitting at a profit of about 5050 something,

1:02:39 $1000. Basically, selling her shares

1:02:41 meant she, when she did, she managed to avoid a loss of

1:02:45 $45,673. Yeah.

1:02:49 So nothing, which I mean for a billionaire, which she is at

1:02:52 this point. Yeah, that's literally coins in

1:02:54 a in a couch. It's it's chump change that is

1:02:57 so in your that's your back pocket money like it's nothing.

1:03:00 No, she'd probably spend that on flowers in a month.

1:03:04 Yeah, she held 3928 shares in the company and yeah, so selling

1:03:09 them all at that point saved her four thousand 45,673 dollars.

1:03:17 So just keep that in mind. Just keep that in mind.

1:03:20 Yeah. So the FDA, this is in December

1:03:24 of 2001, the FDA announces that the Urbatux denial and you know,

1:03:33 the stock obviously went down drastically because everybody

1:03:37 was pitting their hopes on this one drug that the company was

1:03:41 that the company was selling. So then when the I, I guess I

1:03:46 think the FBI was sort of looking into it because they

1:03:49 noticed. So what they noticed in the lead

1:03:51 up to this announcement was there was a huge amount of

1:03:54 trading on the in clone stock. Yeah.

1:03:56 And when they say trading, it was a lot of a lot of people

1:04:00 were selling. So the FBI actually, and the the

1:04:04 US Securities Exchange, they were all looking into what had

1:04:09 happened in those preceding days.

1:04:11 Yeah. And what they found was there

1:04:12 was a list of, I think it was like 17 people.

1:04:16 It ended up, I think by the time they went to court it was.

1:04:19 Two or three, Yeah. I think it was really only Sam

1:04:21 and Harlan, his brother. Yeah.

1:04:23 And then there was. A Martha then?

1:04:25 So it was 3 was it? Yeah, well, that, yeah, but she

1:04:28 was, she was convicted of something separate to that,

1:04:30 though. Yeah, but they will look the.

1:04:31 Real, they looked at to her. Yeah, because she'd sold her

1:04:34 shares two days before. Yeah, this announcement was

1:04:37 made. Yeah, you know to the to the

1:04:40 profit of 50 grand like. Well, not profit, but she didn't

1:04:43 lose that. She stopped.

1:04:45 No, it was to the profit. She bought them for 250,000,

1:04:48 sold it for 300,000. No, because she because when she

1:04:54 so she bought them at $75 a share or they got went up to $75

1:04:58 a share and she sold them at $63 a share.

1:05:01 Oh. OK, so I think she she'd have a

1:05:03 loss, but she could have lost if she'd sold a date, like when, if

1:05:06 she'd waited, if she'd sold them with everyone else.

1:05:08 Yeah. Like which it dropped 16% the

1:05:10 following day. Yeah.

1:05:11 If she'd sold them then when she found out.

1:05:14 Oh, it's not being FDA approved. Oh, now we'll sell.

1:05:17 She would have lost $45,000. Forty.

1:05:19 Yeah. Yeah.

1:05:21 So it was dropping, but hadn't dropped completely.

1:05:23 Yeah. Right.

1:05:24 But the end of that day on the 27th of December, they dropped

1:05:28 to $60.00, which is what they talk about in terms of like

1:05:32 that. She she said that her and Peter

1:05:34 had a deal that if it dropped to 6060 dollars a share then they'd

1:05:37 sell. But did they that conversation

1:05:41 or not? Yeah, Did you?

1:05:42 Yeah, it's awesome. Because it had dropped to $60.00

1:05:45 previously and they hadn't sold exactly.

1:05:47 So as much as it had been $75 building up to this, it had

1:05:51 previously to this fluctuated around that $60.00 mark.

1:05:54 Shares do as they do, yes. So yeah.

1:05:58 So the US Attorney's office contacted Martha's attorneys to

1:06:02 be interviewed about this because they obviously noted

1:06:04 that she was one of the people who sold their shares in those

1:06:07 preceding days. Yeah.

1:06:09 Her attorneys advised her to answer truthfully.

1:06:13 And if she didn't remember something to say, to say either

1:06:18 I do not remember or I do not recall.

1:06:20 Yeah, and so, well, this is where things get a little

1:06:24 tetchy. Yeah, what frustrated them?

1:06:26 Very much so because she they would ask her questions that

1:06:30 they knew the answer to and she would say I do not recall, I

1:06:34 don't, I don't remember. And what they felt like she was

1:06:40 obstructing the course of justice.

1:06:42 Yeah. Yeah.

1:06:44 So in June of 2002, we find out that, like, as in we as the

1:06:50 public find out that Martha's being investigated for this.

1:06:54 And my God, does the shit hit the fan immediately.

1:06:58 So Martha Stewart, America's golden woman everywhere.

1:07:02 She's everywhere. Everyone loves her.

1:07:05 She's she's the woman that so many American and international

1:07:09 women want to be. Yeah, it's somebody we aspire to

1:07:12 but could never achieve because, I mean, seriously.

1:07:14 God no, don't have time. She the media turn on her Yeah

1:07:21 in an instant she's labeled as a liar, a cheat, messy master.

1:07:28 Yes, I love it And and they're like they they even, you know,

1:07:32 poke fun at her appearance. They, they, they say she's, you

1:07:36 know, look how terrible she looks now she's put on 250 lbs.

1:07:40 I'm like, whoa, she hasn't doubled her weight overnight.

1:07:42 Like God, it's just, it's absolutely.

1:07:45 Mental absolutely love one of the TV shows that she got

1:07:49 absolutely came for afterwards too.

1:07:51 So this is fairly early days and all this that she's been looked

1:07:53 at and she's still doing her normal stuff that she's been

1:07:56 booked for to go in and do this show to make.

1:07:58 She's making this salad and this woman's interviewing.

1:08:01 She had been told prior to the this going look, they're gonna

1:08:03 bring it up. You need to be prepared that

1:08:04 they're gonna ask you questions about, you know what's.

1:08:06 Going on everywhere. Everywhere, of course they're

1:08:09 gonna ask you. So she had been told this by her

1:08:12 people to be prepared. She's busily making her salad

1:08:15 and answering some questions. And but the, the interviewer,

1:08:17 she kept really pushing on this stuff about what was going on

1:08:21 with the FBI and who she and why she's being investigated and,

1:08:25 and she's like, she got so irritated that she's like, I

1:08:27 just want to focus on my salad. I just wanna make my salad.

1:08:32 But look, in that interview, though, I can understand it

1:08:34 because I felt like her, her response when that interviewer

1:08:37 first asked her. Yeah, was good.

1:08:39 She said. I can't really talk about it.

1:08:41 It's still being investigated. Yeah, I'm hoping it'll all be

1:08:44 cleared up. You'll sort it out.

1:08:45 Big, big misunderstanding. But I can't really talk about

1:08:48 specific details. It's completely.

1:08:50 Fair. Completely fair, but she's and

1:08:52 then this one should keep pushing her and she's like I

1:08:53 just want to make my decision, want to make my soul and then

1:08:55 everyone. Then that became the headline

1:08:57 everywhere. Didn't all.

1:08:58 The late night shows all grabbed that one and used it.

1:09:01 I loved it. And that really did like, it was

1:09:04 an absolute turning point for her.

1:09:06 Yeah, yeah, I find the next bit really friggin uncomfortable.

1:09:11 Yeah. So this is, I'm talking about

1:09:14 the US District Attorney Jim Comedy.

1:09:18 He comes and does a press conference.

1:09:21 So he, they're the ones who have now decided to charge.

1:09:25 Yeah, Martha, in relation to, well, at the time they thought

1:09:32 it would be an insider trading charge.

1:09:35 And then they were talking about obstruction of justice and lying

1:09:38 to the FBI and the SEC. It was all a bit even he wasn't

1:09:43 fully clear, to be honest, in that first, in that first media

1:09:47 press conference thing. Yeah.

1:09:50 He says he's like lying to the FBI is a very serious offence.

1:09:54 And. And someone, one of the

1:09:55 journalists asked him, if it wasn't Martha, would you be

1:09:58 doing this? And he said, well, absolutely,

1:10:01 it's not because it's Martha that we're pursuing this.

1:10:03 It's because she's done wrong. Now how many fucking people have

1:10:05 lied to the FBI who don't then don't have a criminal charge

1:10:08 brought against? Them.

1:10:09 Yeah, yeah. You know, she was just, I mean,

1:10:11 I get it, she was probably being obstructive in not answering

1:10:16 questions, but she had every right to not answer those

1:10:19 questions. Yeah, that's right, I would have

1:10:21 thought. Well, that that's not one of the

1:10:23 things that, well, no, they did bring that charge against her,

1:10:26 so maybe. She did because, well, they do

1:10:28 question. So the whole thing that went

1:10:30 down, though, is that there was Peter.

1:10:33 Oh, God. I can't guess.

1:10:34 What's his surname? Bakanovich.

1:10:36 Yeah. So Peter Bakanovich.

1:10:37 And then his assistant, Douglas Fanuel.

1:10:43 So the two of them basically, they couldn't really get their

1:10:46 story straight. Yeah.

1:10:47 So and look, Douglas did come out.

1:10:49 He open honest. He was the the guy who did it

1:10:52 all. He was just following

1:10:53 instructions According to him. And so he was very honest with

1:10:55 the FBI. Yeah.

1:10:57 So whereas Peter and Martha had this whole line of, you know,

1:11:00 well, I told, you know, Peter that we would, you know, sell

1:11:03 out the stock if it hit $60.00, which then, you know, Douglas is

1:11:07 coming out going. And I was never told that.

1:11:09 I was just told directed by Peter to sell the stock because

1:11:14 it had it would they'd been told it wasn't wasn't going to get

1:11:16 FDA approved. So sell the stock.

1:11:19 So he just, he did what he said. So therefore they've got her on

1:11:21 the fact that she's lying because like he specifically

1:11:25 says that there was no conversation, no conversation of

1:11:28 that. The one that really gets so

1:11:29 though in the court is her best friend.

1:11:32 This. Is so freaking sad.

1:11:35 Is really Mariana Pasternak? Yeah.

1:11:39 So whilst this is going on, so while the whole this whole

1:11:42 situation of whether it's going to get FDA approval and

1:11:45 everything is going on, it's December 27th and they are on

1:11:48 holidays on a yacht somewhere, you know, having their time.

1:11:52 First calls that they took was they were on a private.

1:11:55 So they were on Martha's. I mean, she didn't own a

1:11:57 private. In fact, I could think it was

1:11:59 actually her boyfriend. What's his name?

1:12:03 Microsoft guy? Sorry, what's his name?

1:12:05 Yeah, Charles. Yes, they were on his private

1:12:09 jet and they were making their way down to Mexico.

1:12:11 Yes. And they had to stop to refuel,

1:12:13 I think in Arizona or something like that.

1:12:15 And while she was on the ground in Arizona, she decided to call

1:12:19 because she said, you know, I was the CEO of a big company.

1:12:21 I had to check in all the time, even when I was on holidays.

1:12:24 And Mariana was there when she checked in.

1:12:27 And part of this check in was, according to Mariana, a phone

1:12:32 call with Peter Bakanovic. And she says that Martha said in

1:12:38 that phone call after that phone.

1:12:40 Call with him. Isn't it nice to have brokers

1:12:43 who tell you those things? Yeah.

1:12:45 And that is what she testified in court.

1:12:48 Now those do want friends no more.

1:12:50 Oh no, she said. Martha actually said sorry.

1:12:52 Mariana actually says that she saw Martha's eyes change and she

1:12:58 knew in court and she knew that that's it, their friends are

1:13:02 done forever. Well, yeah, absolutely.

1:13:04 You've really fucking fucked her over.

1:13:05 Because then she later recants. Are you?

1:13:08 But I'm not joking. Years and years and years later,

1:13:12 she says she admitted to say that she wasn't entirely sure if

1:13:17 that's what she heard or whether that's just what she was

1:13:20 thinking in the moment. This is well after she'd gone to

1:13:23 prison and been released from prison.

1:13:25 So OK, I don't know what's worse in this, but is she saying that

1:13:29 because she now knows that piss Martha off because that's so

1:13:34 bullshit, or has she realized that Oh no, I didn't, that

1:13:37 really didn't get said. I don't.

1:13:38 What a Dick. What a Dick.

1:13:40 Why would you come out and publicly say?

1:13:41 Sorry, but I would lie for you. Yeah, I'd lie for you.

1:13:43 Seriously. Seriously, it's just, it's not

1:13:50 OK. No, that's not a bestie.

1:13:53 It's not a bestie. I mean, look what what Martha

1:13:56 said actually, and this is completely fair, she said.

1:14:00 I don't expect people to lie in court.

1:14:02 And it's not an expectation. If you're subpoenaed and you

1:14:05 have to testify, you know your best friend shouldn't expect you

1:14:09 to purge yourself. But how would the how would the

1:14:11 FBI or whoever's investigating this know to ask the question

1:14:14 for you to give that information exactly?

1:14:16 Like you're only lying if they've asked that question.

1:14:19 That's right. You've just like, that's the

1:14:21 reason for the information. Yeah.

1:14:23 You don't answer anything you haven't been asked.

1:14:25 We're going to ask you this in court now.

1:14:27 You. Yeah.

1:14:27 Yeah, this is now your testimony.

1:14:29 Yeah, and she maybe couldn't back down from it.

1:14:32 I don't know. I don't know.

1:14:33 The answer is always I don't remember, I don't know, I don't

1:14:36 recall. No, I don't recall.

1:14:39 Yep. I got all for $45,000 anyway.

1:14:44 Douglas Fanuel though, she describes like he came out and

1:14:48 like absolutely berated Martha after Yes because he hated her.

1:14:52 Absolutely hated. He was awful to.

1:14:54 Her I've never been treated more rudely by a stranger on the

1:14:58 phone because he he didn't really know her, he didn't have

1:15:00 the regular contact, he was the. Underling in this situation,

1:15:03 Peter was the person that was, you know, oh, he was the

1:15:05 intelligent stockbroker. Yeah, Douglas was the assistant,

1:15:08 you know, kind of thing that he got treated that way and which

1:15:10 is awful. Yeah.

1:15:11 No one deserves to get treated like that.

1:15:12 He says she actually hung up on me and had the nerve to mention

1:15:16 layoffs in her anger. Like basically saying you're

1:15:18 gonna get fired if you do this or say this.

1:15:21 I think you're all going to jail, yeah.

1:15:24 Well, he actually did get a fine Daniel.

1:15:26 He did? Yep. $2000, I think it was

1:15:28 something like that. Yeah, Peter.

1:15:31 And he was just following instructions on from his.

1:15:33 Employer, but then he also then struggled to find another job.

1:15:36 Yeah, well. So it was, it was a very

1:15:38 impactful situation for a very young aspiring stockbroker.

1:15:42 For sure. So with all this though, too,

1:15:45 Martha's own company obviously had impact as well, and that was

1:15:49 part of what the charges ended up being.

1:15:51 Yeah, where that she was basically not lying, I guess is

1:15:55 part of it, but you know, falsely, you know, presenting

1:15:58 things to her own stock shareholders.

1:16:00 Yeah. So she did lose like 145 million

1:16:04 in her shares of her of her company.

1:16:07 Yeah. So it did impact, I mean, but

1:16:09 out of a billion dollar company, it's still a bit of a drop in

1:16:11 the ocean still, I guess. So not a hell of a lot.

1:16:15 So yeah, there was the ultimate there was the two charges of the

1:16:18 lying to the FBI and then the lying and falsifying things for

1:16:22 her stock, her, her shareholders.

1:16:23 So the, the official things were providing a false statement and

1:16:27 obstruction of justice. The the clincher that they got

1:16:31 her on though for the lying part and the obstruction of justice.

1:16:36 I guess this kind of pertains to both.

1:16:37 But she she actually said to the FBI, she did not recall being

1:16:41 informed that the Waxhaws were selling their in clone in clone

1:16:44 stock. So you don't remember having a

1:16:49 conversation about whether like you would remember if you didn't

1:16:51 have it, and you'd remember if you.

1:16:52 Did have it but. You can't say.

1:16:54 I don't recall. No.

1:16:55 You either had it or you didn't. And I think that's really kind

1:16:58 of what they got. Her on, got her on.

1:16:59 Yeah. Interesting.

1:17:01 Yeah. She was sentenced to five months

1:17:03 in. Well, she calls it camp like.

1:17:07 She didn't call it camp. She called it camp, did she?

1:17:10 Yeah. And if and if she didn't call it

1:17:11 camp instead of jail, she called it Yale.

1:17:14 Yale, I thought. I thought the media named it

1:17:19 Cupcake Camp or. Something is called that.

1:17:21 That's what they call it. Like as in the people who who

1:17:24 live there, like, you know, the the.

1:17:26 Inmates. They call it Camp Cupcake

1:17:29 because it is like a it's, it's limited in security prison.

1:17:32 And so it's a bit of a walk in the park.

1:17:34 A federal prison, still a federal prison.

1:17:36 So, yeah. But she would refer to it as

1:17:38 when I was at camp like, rather than saying like when I was in

1:17:40 prison. So funny.

1:17:41 Yeah, yeah, because you wouldn't wanna, I mean everybody for.

1:17:43 Everybody. No Yale, Martha, no Yale.

1:17:46 Sorry, Yale. Yale, Martha.

1:17:48 Jeez, man. I just love that.

1:17:50 But. She did a lot there when she was

1:17:52 there. She absolutely she started

1:17:54 programs, she taught them how she taught a lot of the women

1:17:56 how to garden and tend to. I mean, they had not a lot of

1:17:59 resources, much to Martha's absolute disgust.

1:18:02 They didn't even have, they didn't even have fertilizer for

1:18:05 the garden. But she helped set up a

1:18:09 gardening program. She helped to teach them to cook

1:18:12 and plan parties and meals and do things to imagine Martha

1:18:19 Stewart prison. Oh, that's a good idea for a

1:18:21 That's a really good idea for a magazine.

1:18:23 Absolutely. Oh book, Come on.

1:18:26 Book Oh, why not go all out? Go.

1:18:27 All out, yeah. So she, you know, she, I think

1:18:30 she did her best in the five months she was then was it

1:18:34 another five months at home? Yeah, under house arrest.

1:18:37 Under house arrest with a ankle bracelet on.

1:18:39 Yeah, she loved that thing. She'd flash it, flash it to the

1:18:42 media as they would take photos of her.

1:18:44 So yeah, you know, she kind of played along with.

1:18:46 It I guess she did by that point.

1:18:48 I think she was pretty comfortable with it all that

1:18:50 that's what was going on. I think you know what she so I

1:18:53 don't remember when she was about to go to prison.

1:18:55 There was one interview where she said, you know, it'll be

1:18:58 fine. That's fine.

1:18:59 Many people, many good people have been to to prison.

1:19:02 Look at Nelson Mandela. Hey, Martha.

1:19:11 She did say that the food was atrocious.

1:19:13 There was nothing nutritious to eat.

1:19:15 No, nothing. That all just tasted so bland.

1:19:18 And this is the other one. Oh yeah, go.

1:19:20 The camp is like an old fashioned college campus, just

1:19:23 without freedom. Oh.

1:19:29 She's she's gold, that woman is. Gold.

1:19:31 Oh God. So in 2004 though, the biggest

1:19:34 selling Halloween costume in the American in America was a Martha

1:19:37 Stewart costume of her in like the in like.

1:19:41 A. Orange jumpsuit.

1:19:42 Oh I love. It oh, that's so good.

1:19:45 See, she still had influence. Oh, this is it.

1:19:47 And look, when she was released, I mean, none of her companies

1:19:50 really hit. They went jumping, jumping off

1:19:52 it, you know, again, they took off and came back.

1:19:55 It wasn't like. They're still going to this day.

1:19:57 They're all still going to this day.

1:19:59 Oh, yeah. Because she's a convicted felon,

1:20:00 though, she can no longer sit on the board of a company, so she's

1:20:03 no longer the CEO of any of her. Companies or their subsidiaries,

1:20:08 Yeah. But she certainly still has

1:20:11 involvement day-to-day. And as you said, she's, you

1:20:14 know, well into her. Well, she's in her 80s now,

1:20:17 still has daily input into everything that goes on.

1:20:20 I mean, if something's going out under your name, I I kind of get

1:20:23 wanting to have full control. But for sure she has the

1:20:26 wherewithal to keep it all going.

1:20:28 I just don't even know. Well, I mean, not it, you know,

1:20:31 age of 81 and doing a swimsuit. Sports Illustrated edition.

1:20:35 Wow on the cover. Wasn't cheap, but fucking

1:20:38 gorgeous. That unbelievable she looks.

1:20:40 Amazing. Like, does that just make

1:20:43 everybody else at that age feel like shit?

1:20:46 But then she. May feel like shit, yeah, but.

1:20:47 Then she's been doing that her whole life.

1:20:50 Like, you know, nothing that anyone could do would come near

1:20:53 to what she did. Even I, I remember in one of the

1:20:56 documentaries I watched, she was arranging strawberries in a

1:20:59 basket and even that looked amazing.

1:21:00 I'm like. I couldn't do that.

1:21:02 No, I mean, God, I'd make that look shit.

1:21:03 I wear. I could definitely make that

1:21:05 look shit. Yeah.

1:21:06 Yeah. And she just touched.

1:21:07 It and it touched. Yeah.

1:21:09 Go. She was.

1:21:09 She was incredible. Oh.

1:21:11 Absolutely incredible. Just before she went into

1:21:14 prison, actually, the I think this is in the same interview

1:21:17 that you were just referring to before.

1:21:18 Yeah, she said, they said to her, how do you prepare to go

1:21:22 into prison? And she goes, I don't know, you

1:21:24 go to the dentist, you go to the gynecologist, you get your body

1:21:27 and mind in the best shape. And the interview was like, oh,

1:21:32 OK. And she's like, oh, that.

1:21:33 I don't want to talk about it anymore.

1:21:34 Move on. Well, the Barbara Walters

1:21:38 interview, too, where, like where She said to her, you know,

1:21:40 what are you preparing, you know, for jail and things and,

1:21:43 you know, and what about strip searches?

1:21:44 And Martha went, oh, I think you should educate yourself.

1:21:47 Yeah, there won't be strip searches.

1:21:48 And then Barbara Walters went, you might want to look into that

1:21:53 because I believe. And then she says, she says in

1:21:56 one of her diary entries, which has been since been released,

1:21:58 she said when she walked into prison, she in her diary.

1:22:02 So she went into prison on Friday the 8th of October in

1:22:04 2004. And in her diary, she wrote

1:22:08 diary, sorry, she wrote pearls OK, no contacts.

1:22:13 So she was allowed to wear her pearls in pearls.

1:22:15 OK at Yale squat arms out cough. She had to be stripped to naked

1:22:23 squat squat cough. When she was in prison, her.

1:22:27 Boy was like a dog. Oh, Martha.

1:22:35 Her boyfriend Charles did not contact her throughout her trial

1:22:39 or when she was in prison. She wrote him letters and he

1:22:42 never responded until one day he did contact her and let her know

1:22:50 that he was actually no sorry. This was after she'd been

1:22:53 released from prison. When she was released from

1:22:56 prison, he did send his private jet to get her back home.

1:22:59 Yes, we'll talk about that. Yeah, OK.

1:23:00 We'll talk about that in a second.

1:23:01 Yep. They were then overseas on a

1:23:04 holiday. I'm guessing Martha probably

1:23:06 just needed a bit of a break once she was out of of house

1:23:09 arrest and they were in bed together in a hotel in Paris.

1:23:12 I think she said. And he basically rolled over to

1:23:15 her and said, well, I'm getting married and her parents don't

1:23:17 ever want me to see you again. And that was it.

1:23:19 He's she's never seen him again. Oh my God.

1:23:21 But he didn't even, she didn't even know he had somebody who

1:23:24 was so serious with that he was about to marry like. 1.

1:23:28 Relationship. They were together for 15 years,

1:23:31 according to Martha. Yeah, yeah, as you, you've

1:23:33 referred to this before. She said it was her second

1:23:35 divorce. Yeah, she called that her second

1:23:37 divorce like. Crazy.

1:23:38 Yeah, Yeah. Inside.

1:23:40 Tell me about the plane. So the plane she so yeah, he did

1:23:43 collect her and had the private plane like take bring her home

1:23:46 and she gets off the plane and what is she wearing?

1:23:48 Oh yes. The poncho.

1:23:50 The poncho which? One of her very close friends,

1:23:53 Tinder, I went, what the fuck are you wearing?

1:23:55 And she's like, isn't it amazing?

1:23:57 It's just gorgeous. So it turns out her poncho that

1:24:00 she was wearing was made by one of her fellow inmates and who

1:24:04 had learned how to, you know, crochet whilst they were

1:24:06 together. And she made her this poncho to

1:24:09 leave in and she wore it. She, you know, fully embraced

1:24:12 this, you know, of what this person had.

1:24:13 Because I mean, I think this is where I go.

1:24:15 I love her and I hate her. I know I.

1:24:17 Love it. She like really helped this

1:24:18 woman, you know, who had nothing she'd obviously, you know, done

1:24:20 something in her life that had put her in that position and and

1:24:23 Martha helped her out and taught her a skill and because her one

1:24:26 of her big sayings is learn something new everyday.

1:24:28 And that was we're playing while she was in prison too, that she

1:24:31 would learn something new everyday and she was helping

1:24:33 others learn something new. Amazing.

1:24:35 Wow, great use of an. Hour.

1:24:37 Yep, but that poncho was so incredibly popular.

1:24:41 The yarn company that got hold of the patent for it and put it

1:24:46 on their website and sold it as the Martha poncho as she exited

1:24:49 the plane. It was the most downloaded

1:24:52 pattern that I had ever had on the in the entire history.

1:24:56 I really hope that inmate got some.

1:24:59 Royalties or something? I hope so.

1:25:01 I I did couldn't find any more about it in terms of that like.

1:25:04 I'd hope Martha would do that. Would she though?

1:25:07 This is the thing, I don't know if there's a penny to make.

1:25:10 Addiction. I don't know.

1:25:11 It's so bizarre. She is, She is.

1:25:15 In April of 2019, she. Oh, actually, this is getting a

1:25:19 little bit ahead. Should we talk?

1:25:21 I think now's the time that we need to talk about Martha.

1:25:24 It is done, Snoop. The most unlikely pairing of

1:25:31 people probably to ever exist. I love this pairing.

1:25:36 They are the greatest besties. I think it's awesome.

1:25:40 Snoop Dog and Martha. Stewart How did they meet?

1:25:44 Oh my God, it is just. No.

1:25:46 Do you know how they met? Yeah, yeah, they so I mean it's

1:25:50 it's are we talking about the? The Bieber roast.

1:25:54 Yeah, the roast. Oh this is actually so funny.

1:25:57 Have you seen the Bieber Roast? It is actually amazing so if

1:26:01 you. Have not seen it, Google it.

1:26:04 The shit that comes out of that woman's mouth is gold.

1:26:06 It is so good, it's. Really good.

1:26:08 I love how she explains to make a Shiv.

1:26:10 Yeah. She's like, I got, I've got the

1:26:13 end of my comb and yeah, anyway, it's really good.

1:26:16 So she but she like hangs shit on everyone.

1:26:19 She she said when they asked her to do the roast, she didn't

1:26:23 realise that she'd be roasted too.

1:26:25 So she was the butt of many a joke that night, but she took it

1:26:28 all in her stride. She did, you know, she didn't

1:26:29 care. She laughed along with it, It

1:26:30 was great. But she was sitting next to

1:26:32 Snoop Dogg that night. But, well, so she said.

1:26:34 For two days straight, they rehearsed on them on the first

1:26:37 day, so she sat with him that day as well and then followed

1:26:39 the two days for the second day. Then for the actual filming,

1:26:42 obviously again sitting next to him, she goes well.

1:26:43 Two days of taking in second hand smoke from his marijuana

1:26:48 smoking. I was so sky.

1:26:52 Apparently he just smokes blunts.

1:26:54 All day long. On a on a day when he's doing

1:26:58 something like that, he can smoke up to 25 pints a day.

1:27:00 Well, it. Probably takes that much for it

1:27:04 to actually hit the side like. An alcoholic, it must be like

1:27:07 you just need more and more to have an effect.

1:27:09 But not for Martha, No. Although Martha does very she's

1:27:12 she holds. Herself.

1:27:14 Together. Oh, she absolutely does.

1:27:15 But she's absolutely adamant that she has never smoked pot.

1:27:20 No, just second hand. Second hand, maybe a gummy here

1:27:22 and there. She would totally do gummies.

1:27:25 Oh, for sure. Yeah, well, she has her own

1:27:28 company. Now, yeah, that's true.

1:27:29 That's true. Oh, God, yeah.

1:27:32 I mean, what? Doesn't she have a company?

1:27:34 Doing totally. Seriously.

1:27:36 But anyway, so they became really good friends and in a

1:27:38 really short amount of time, and they spent a huge, they realized

1:27:41 that. They had so much in common.

1:27:44 I know it's so very funny. It's just so.

1:27:46 Unlikely. I love teaching people things.

1:27:48 And because I've always loved Snoop, I think he's cooking

1:27:50 great. Yeah.

1:27:51 Yeah. I mean, yeah, he loves, well,

1:27:52 cooking. Brownies, mainly.

1:27:53 Yeah. Green Brownies.

1:27:54 Of course, I think in one of the cooking shows they did together,

1:27:59 that was the first recipe. Yeah, that was the first one

1:28:01 they did was sow brownies. Yep, yeah, I do love me a bit of

1:28:07 Snoop. It's just good.

1:28:10 He's just he. I want to say he's wholesome

1:28:13 like contradiction that he's not, but he.

1:28:15 Knows, but I get, I do get what you're saying.

1:28:17 Yeah. He's, he's good people.

1:28:19 He is. Yeah.

1:28:20 Yeah. I just having like star skin

1:28:22 Hutch. Yeah, another great movie.

1:28:25 Go check that one out. Yeah, he does that so good.

1:28:29 He's so, he is so good. He is so good and he just kind

1:28:32 of, I mean, I guess if you're that stoned all the time, you're

1:28:35 just rolling, going with the flow and really easygoing.

1:28:38 And I think that would probably suit Martha's personality to

1:28:41 attain they just. Well, yeah, they just.

1:28:43 Hit it. Off they go.

1:28:43 They go everywhere together. They traveled together.

1:28:45 They went to the MTV Music Awards together.

1:28:48 They've been all around the world doing all different things

1:28:51 for both of their careers. They've started businesses

1:28:54 together. Yeah, they, they're really in

1:28:57 each other's lives. And this has been going on since

1:28:58 what, 2015 I think? Yeah.

1:29:01 Something like that. So what do we talk 10 years now?

1:29:04 And just. Fully ingrained in each other's

1:29:06 lives. Yeah, yeah, to.

1:29:07 This day. And look, Martha's advice kept

1:29:10 Justin Bieber out of jail, too. So that's.

1:29:12 True, Justin would have done as well as Martha in prison.

1:29:17 Let's face. It.

1:29:18 Oh God, no. It's very pretty.

1:29:22 Arrived in the. Same way.

1:29:23 No, I don't think so. I think she.

1:29:25 Wouldn't be sitting in the corner crocheting with people.

1:29:27 No, and also Martha's a bit of an alpha dog at the best of.

1:29:30 Times. Oh, Can you imagine?

1:29:31 She would definitely have established dominance very

1:29:33 quickly. Yeah, for sure.

1:29:35 Most important thing when you go to prison?

1:29:37 Absolutely. I still have my kids all the

1:29:40 time. We've.

1:29:41 Established dominance early. There's only one of one of your

1:29:44 kids. Needs only one that I worry

1:29:46 about. We both know which one for both

1:29:50 of us really don't. Now I want to know what you

1:29:56 think of Martha's like conviction and sentencing.

1:29:59 Yeah, right. Look, I do think they went after

1:30:02 her and wanted like, someone to be held accountable for that and

1:30:05 something, something very public.

1:30:07 Yeah. I don't know that she it needed

1:30:09 to be that, but I mean, she did the wrong thing.

1:30:12 But as we said, for 45 grand out of billions of dollars that

1:30:15 she's worth, I think there was other things they could have

1:30:17 been spending their time, you know?

1:30:19 For sure. Looking at so I don't really

1:30:22 think that look as much as I kind of love what it brought to

1:30:26 our US versus as a society and what it's brought to us

1:30:29 afterwards. How she and the the way she has

1:30:31 come out of it, the other side is incredible.

1:30:33 I think it changed her as a person.

1:30:35 She says that. Because I will, I look at it

1:30:37 from her relationship with her daughter.

1:30:39 Yep. So it was like her relationship

1:30:41 with her daughter is very interesting, fairly like it's

1:30:45 it's never been great in the past.

1:30:47 Whereas I think she's because Martha's softened through going

1:30:51 to prison, which is not too many people could say that that's.

1:30:53 Generally has the opposite. Yeah that I think it's actually

1:30:57 build a better relationship with her daughter because they she

1:31:00 can have they can have fun about herself yeah and so therefore I

1:31:03 think it's embraced her daughter more yeah because have you

1:31:05 watched any of her daughter's stuff that she's done I.

1:31:07 Have her daughter. Her daughter is She is a.

1:31:13 What's the word? She is a a shocked entity unto

1:31:17 herself. Like, you know, I mean, she's

1:31:20 obviously grown up in the shadows of her mum, but she's a

1:31:24 very interesting character. Yeah, yeah, she.

1:31:27 Looks a lot like Martha. She definitely looks like Martha

1:31:29 and she's like stunning, you know, she's.

1:31:31 But she's she's. They've been described as the

1:31:34 Howard, the female Howard Stern. Yeah, in the work that she does,

1:31:37 she's done some like radio shows and TV shows and you can YouTube

1:31:42 them and look at her stuff. And I love the ones that she's

1:31:45 done with Martha in terms of she does a series called Whatever

1:31:49 Martha with Alexis and Jennifer, which is her Co host and they're

1:31:54 pretty hilarious. They take the piss out of old

1:31:57 episodes of Martha Stewart Living, which is just it was one

1:32:01 I was watching where the two of the where she's making s'mores

1:32:04 and they were like, oh, smalls, Yum.

1:32:06 She just, you know, show us how to make the smalls.

1:32:08 No, she shows to them how to whittle the stick to put the

1:32:11 marshmallow on and like it's just.

1:32:12 Like. They're like, what the hell is

1:32:15 she doing now? Like, you know.

1:32:17 Yeah. And it's just gorgeous the way

1:32:18 that like, Alexis can take the piss out of her mum.

1:32:21 And and, you know, there is a couple of episodes where Martha

1:32:24 joins in on this too, like, and so she can take the piss out of

1:32:27 herself. Yeah, it's it's good.

1:32:28 But I think in the past she could have done that.

1:32:31 So yeah, I mean, I think it's, I think it's been good for her.

1:32:35 I don't know whether it needed to happen.

1:32:37 I don't think so. I think I read somewhere that

1:32:40 she paid the bitch tax and I think.

1:32:43 I think that's. Fair.

1:32:44 I think she was being obstructive for the sake of

1:32:47 being obstructive in some ways. I don't think she know.

1:32:51 I mean, whether she knew or didn't know to the financial

1:32:54 benefit, but the financial benefit to her, whether she did

1:32:57 it or didn't do it would have made zero difference to her

1:33:00 life. Yeah.

1:33:01 So I find that kind of a bit like, why would she get even

1:33:04 care? Why would she risk?

1:33:06 It yeah, I know. I think, I think in stupidity,

1:33:09 like she's done the whole like, Oh yeah, offload it then if

1:33:11 that's what's gonna happen, sell it.

1:33:12 Thought about the consequences. Actual consequences of that

1:33:15 thinking like I. Also don't think that you know

1:33:17 anyone else who had have come up against this would never it

1:33:20 would never have gone to court. They've asked federal

1:33:23 prosecutors you know subsequently and they've given

1:33:27 Martha's case to them de identified to young and up and

1:33:32 coming USDA's who don't really know a huge amount about this.

1:33:35 Yeah. Not one of them has said that

1:33:37 they would prosecute her. No, there's nothing there to

1:33:39 prosecute nothing there. It's not worth their time.

1:33:41 I I should have she went spending time because she's

1:33:44 Martha Stewart and they could make AI don't know Yeah a

1:33:47 mockery out of her. I don't know I I think it's I

1:33:49 think it's so unfair Yeah. But then, as you said, it really

1:33:52 did change her life and it makes her life in a lot of ways.

1:33:56 So, so much so that she ended up having to sell her media empire

1:33:59 because she couldn't, as we said before, couldn't be the CEO.

1:34:03 She could no longer run things the way that she wanted to.

1:34:06 So she made the decision to sell in 2019.

1:34:08 Yeah, she sold it for 175,000,000, which was a lot

1:34:11 less than what it. Was worth doing it originally.

1:34:14 Exactly I. Mean, to this day I think she's

1:34:16 worth about 400 mil. Yeah.

1:34:17 So I mean. More I think, but but still

1:34:19 like, you know, at one point she was a.

1:34:22 A billionaire. So yeah, she's definitely less

1:34:24 than she was. Yeah, but I mean I'd I'd take

1:34:27 400 mil. Yeah, I would.

1:34:28 I'll look. I wouldn't.

1:34:29 Sneeze at it. One of my all time favorite

1:34:34 quotes of hers though is that if you want to be happy for a year,

1:34:39 get married. If you want to be happy for a

1:34:42 decade, get a dog. If you want to be happy for a

1:34:45 lifetime, plant a garden. Not.

1:34:49 Not you, no. God, I would not.

1:34:51 Be happy you take that advice. No, no, but I just love it.

1:34:53 It wouldn't be for a year. Get married.

1:34:55 That's only going to last for a year.

1:34:57 That happiness. She's not really.

1:34:58 It's I know. I more I like listen to her.

1:35:00 I'm like, hmm, there's something in that.

1:35:03 Yeah, but the garden thing, Oh God, I could murder that.

1:35:06 Yeah, maybe if you wanted to be happy.

1:35:08 For how long does a plant last without being cared for?

1:35:11 A couple of days in my house. I bought 2 plants on the weekend

1:35:14 by the way. Oh my God.

1:35:17 Oh, I'm gonna have to come over. Yeah, Oh, you are.

1:35:19 Because one of them have to report.

1:35:20 Oh my. God.

1:35:22 Not yet. Apparently I'll come and have a

1:35:25 look. You're gonna have to.

1:35:27 All right, well, what have we? The other thing I just want to

1:35:32 say is jump on her Instagram. Oh.

1:35:35 She loves to post the first trap.

1:35:37 Oh, and perhaps galore, but also like a fucking amazing contract.

1:35:42 She's all over it. The outfit of the day.

1:35:44 Yeah, and TikTok too. She's all over that, too.

1:35:46 Outfit of the day on TikTok. Yeah, she has some amazing.

1:35:49 Clothes. She's in her 80s, she she could

1:35:52 pass for a late 60, early 70s Oh. 50s Oh, I don't think I'm

1:35:59 going to get. Her eyes she needs like but but

1:36:03 still, she's doing very, very well for herself.

1:36:06 Bloody oath. Yeah.

1:36:07 Yeah, go, Martha. Lover.

1:36:10 Hater. I might need to get some of this

1:36:11 CDB gummy surrogate. Yep.

1:36:17 Yep. Good on you Martha.

1:36:18 Love it. What a great episode for episode

1:36:21 50. I know we've had fun.

1:36:23 Yeah, it's been good. It's been a nice light one,

1:36:25 which is exactly what we wanted. Yeah, very.

1:36:27 Good. Yep, let us know what you think.

1:36:29 I'd love to know what everyone else thinks of Martha Stewart.

1:36:31 And for those that like, at what age bracket does Martha drop off

1:36:36 being known? Like I wonder if I asked my 2324

1:36:41 year old cousin, yeah, do you know who Martha Stewart is?

1:36:43 Like I'll have to ask her and see.

1:36:45 Whether she she would, because Snoop Dogg.

1:36:47 Snoop. Yeah.

1:36:55 I don't know. Maybe because of Snoop.

1:36:56 Because, well, that was one of the things they both say.

1:36:59 Snoop's introduced a whole new audience to Martha, and then

1:37:04 vice versa. Yeah.

1:37:05 So people who would never have followed Snoop before now do.

1:37:09 Yeah. And people who would never have

1:37:10 followed Martha before now do. Martha cooking tips.

1:37:13 Yeah, those brownies. So it's a, it's a really

1:37:17 mutually beneficial friendship. Absolutely.

1:37:20 Love that femme. Besties, yeah.

1:37:24 All right. Now next week we are covering

1:37:26 the Susan Powell case. So we're going back.

1:37:29 We, we've, we're up here. We're going back down.

1:37:31 Right down to that one where it involves children and yeah.

1:37:33 Yeah, into a really tough one. Oh, yeah.

1:37:35 So please join us again next week.

1:37:37 Thank you to everybody for joining us for our 50th episode.

1:37:41 Go us. Yay, go in.

1:37:43 Yay, all right. Stay curious, crying besties.

1:37:46 Bye. Come with us with that 50 times.

1:37:48 Now yay. Well, bye, bye.