Episode 37 - Allison Baden-Clay: Part 2

0:16 Welcome back to Crime Besties to Part 2 of our Alison Baden Clay episode. Thank you for joining us. Absolutely welcome, everybody. Number two. Well, we weren't planning this to be A2 parter, but here we are. I I, I always feel a bit like dubbed when there's A2 parter of a favorite podcast of mine and I have to wait a whole week for an episode. Yeah. It's not ideal. It's. Not ideal, but anyway, it is what it is. You didn't. Yeah, this episode would have just been crazy, crazy long if we had released it all in one go to.

0:46 Do it the justice that it deserves. Yeah, I think it was. We needed to have all the information in there. Definitely, yeah, That's it, yeah. We definitely do. We probably get into more of the nitty gritty of it this episode, yeah, so stay tuned. For sure, and if you haven't listened to Part 1 I I really strongly suggest you go back and do that now. For sure, there's a lot more context I think than most places where I certainly what I was listening to and you know, you kind of get these bits from other, other avenues than other podcasts that I found really.

1:14 Agreed. Yeah, agreed. How's your week been? Yeah, just trying to remember. I'm like what? Have I done? Who am I? Where am I? My usual Friday collapse. Yeah, yes, yeah, we're really madly into it now with all the sports return. Like, you know, winter sports are ranch ramping up already, which this just seems insane. I know my, my, my son said to me this week at the first training session for his footy was like mum, it's just wrong to train for footy in in 30° heat. Yeah, it doesn't feel right. No winter.

1:43 Sport with all the parents standing on the sidelines, we're like it's daylight and hot and. Sunny like we need your sunglasses. Normally we don't like footy training. It's dark and freezing and umbrella, Yeah, so it's different, but take it, we'll take. It for now. Oh my God. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, certainly getting back into all those things, yes, But it always brings all the, I don't know, there's always a bit of drama with that stuff, isn't there? Always. Oh, it's just one of those things like we were saying the other day, just grab your popcorn and watch.

2:10 Because, I mean, we're not, we're not those people who kind of get involved in a lot of the sporting drama legit. Rocked up with my popcorn. This. Week, but we definitely like to watch from the sidelines and see what's going on because there are people who definitely who get really into it and look, I I get that you want what's best for your kid and that kind of thing, but I just kind of I'm more of a whatever happens happens kind of a. Definitely, because I know there's there's something in the background at the moment and I just kind of rocked up this week going well, it's not really my place to say anything, but yeah, I can push buttons on someone else to say it and then I'll just sit back and watch.

2:43 Yeah. Let's see how this all pants are. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's anyway it'll, it'll all work out in the end. It'll all be fine in the end. It's just this, the scheduling of it all that gets me. But anyway. Yeah, yeah. It's all parents trade season coming up with, you know, we sort of switch between sports and different training nights happen and it's like, OK, so all of a sudden we had all of our routine that goes out the window. We've got a whole new one starting and it's else, but it's it's good too.

3:10 It is great. I love it and I love that the kids are active and they've got something on and running around most nights of the week and yeah, stuff, it's good. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know. And I know I always think like I'm mad busy with that. And then I hear, I stand at those things and listen to some of the other parents with what they've got because they've got three kids rather than two and. Some of them do more than two sports and two activities. They do 3:00 and 4:00 and it's like, and I'll kind of go, I couldn't survive.

3:34 2 is my cab. Yeah. 2 is my cab. Yeah. Two each. They do. 2 each. That is more than enough, yeah. Yeah, for everyone's sanity, that's it. I am, you know, in the interest of being really organized, I have taken to doing some meal prep and stuff. And actually Peter does a lot of meal prep on the weekends as well. Yeah. Which is helpful because there just isn't time. By the time you either you need to eat really quickly before sport, or you get home a bit later and then there's no time to cook. But then I feel like I'm spending all day Sunday just cooking.

4:05 Cooking. Yeah. So it's like taking out a whole day of the weekend just to prep, but then it doesn't. It doesn't make the week go easier. It doesn't. Have a double edged sword really. Yeah, it is a kind of nice thing about a walk in at that, you know, because I mean we have nights where we walk in at six, 630. Yeah, we're for 7:30. Yeah, and we don't get any time. It's like between school and that, you know. So it's, it's the first time we're walking into the door of home that you kind of like, right.

4:29 You need to be able to run with it. I always have the routine in the car. There's a certain point in the travel where I'm like, this is my point where I start with that, right. When we walk through the door tonight, I need lunch boxes out of bags. I need one in the shower. I need the other one doing this, like, yeah. And I'll be cooking dinner and, you know, and yeah, they pull something out and microwave it or something. I'll Chuck it in the air fryer is far easier than starting from scratch. And definitely.

4:51 Yeah. Because I mean, I'm meal prep like in that I have everything cut up usually, you know, that's how I usually as I haven't packed groceries, I cut everything. But I've now moved to the whole like, no, I've got a precook. Yeah, because it's just and just so you can Chuck something in the microwave and that time and heat it up. Get it and get it on the table so well As for my boys, you know, dish shop something beige and they're happy. So you know my an air fryer works. Whereas my gourmet child would not.

5:15 That would not suffice. No, no. This morning he, God, he's a, he's an absolute character, this kid. But this morning he was like, oh, what am I gonna have for breakfast? And I went into the pantry and our bread was, our bread was mouldy like I think I only bought it was really good quality Baker's delight bread and. I reckon the better quality is means that there's less preservatives. Yeah, probably doesn't last as. Long I'm I'm wondering if it's 'cause it's been humid and humid. Yeah, that'll do it too.

5:44 2 day. I don't even think I bought it. I think I bought it. 2 days. Ago two days is not good. No. Oh. God, no, that's not right. That's gotta have been sitting on the shelf. But it was Baker's delight. Now I reckon that's been one that's been missed in their rotation. Because that's not gross. So then I'm like, oh, I've got no bread. And Lucas was happy because he got a wrap. And then he loves a wrap. He's just happy to have a wrap. And Ollie found in it in the pantry, a cup of tech bokie, you know, the Korean, those Korean rice cakes with gochu Jang and cheese sauce.

6:19 So he's like, oh, mum, it's fine. I'll have that and a yogurt. So he's like heating this thing up in the microwave and he's using all the bits and the powders and the sauces and and he brought it to me and it was neon orange thing. By the time he finished with it, it looked it smelt disgusting. Like I was like, I would not put that in my mouth because like mum. He was in heaven. The best. Oh my God, that kid. Yeah. I mean, he's literally like he's thrown together. He has literally thrown together a breakfast that anyone else would be like, Mum, that's never happened again.

6:53 Make sure we have bread. Where's all these down? Like, you know, buy more of that stuff. I need more of that, Yeah. Exactly. So yeah, he he went off to school very happy this morning.

7:05 Oh, that's amazing. He's gorgeous. Oh, that would be so. My kids are so regimented. If we're out of one thing, we are screwed. Yeah. Yeah. I mean my other ones exactly like that's. I know what you mean. I know what you mean. Yeah, very good. Should we get into today's case? Yeah, let's head into Alison and get get going. That's it. It'll pick up where we left off last week, so you'll hear a little bit of a cut and yeah, enjoy. Yeah, I think we start off with just days before she goes missing. We were up to with with all of that.

7:34 So enjoy as much as you can. But yeah, we'll see you next week. Monday the 16th of April 2012. This is 3 days, three or four days before her murder. We don't know exactly the time. Of her murder before after midnight, yeah. Gerard went to see Alison's therapist these few days before which he then decides later on to use to his advantage. Like, oh look, I was really trying to work at my marriage and I was like really working hard. Like 3 days before this happened. We were at counselling and we were really working through it.

8:09 Like that worked to his advantage, didn't it? The night before. Are we ready for the night before? Yes. So we're talking Thursday the 18th of April. Yeah. Now in 2012, yeah, Ellison goes to get her hair done. Yeah. And she had it dyed. She was a box redhead. Is that what they call it? I think she was naturally quite Orbanish anyway, but she had the. Yeah, she had, like, really beautiful hair. And she'd gone to the hairdresser anyway because she had a real estate conference she was attending the next day and obviously wanted to.

8:44 Nas was probably due for having a regrowth done. I know when I get to that point, I cannot wait for that appointment to come. To come pass. But I think I can see, I don't know in this, I can see her like coming out in terms of getting back into her work life too. Because she's gone from fairly, you know, doing so well at Flight Centre and being quite, you know, executive status to then having children and being stay at home mom. And she was bloody good at it. And this is sort of her coming out in terms of her returning to work life because she at this stage had a 10 year old, an 8 year old and a 5 year old.

9:17 So, you know, they're all at school. And she's like, I'm getting back into my work life to be like, like, you feel like you're going back into that kind of mode of going, getting dressed up to go to like a work function and present yourself. I don't. I could just see her being excited about that and that other part of herself being able to be utilized. You know, you're no longer just mom. Now you're both like it's yeah, just makes me sad. It makes me sad too. Yeah, that's really sad that night. So the conference that was to be on the 19th was going to be not only attended by Alice.

9:52 The 20th, sorry. The 19th. The next day, the Friday the 19th. No, the the conference was on the 20th. Oh, was it? Yeah. Oh, OK. I thought she had her hair done on the 18th. She might have, but the conference was definitely that she. So yeah, it was definitely. The 20th OK, so she oh, that doesn't anyway, that's fine. She basically, you know, she knows she's going to attend this conference and somehow, Tony, how did Tony McHugh find out that Allison was attending the conference? Did Jared? Jared.

10:27 Told her? Yeah. He just conveniently didn't tell her until the day before. But Allison knew Tony was gonna be there. No, yeah, she knew that. He told her that night. So Tony told Jared, you need to tell Alison that I'm going to be there as well. And that was sort of the catalyst of. A point of contention. That night their their argument was because I think which we don't know, but from what we can take of what's happened, yeah, from what Tony McHugh has, you know, sudden stand and said sort of what's going on that quite possibly that night was the conversation of well, yeah, my my fling is going to be there and Alison being upset about that, right, Yeah, yeah, yeah.

11:10 At 4:59 that evening, Allison's friend texted her about some dresses. So her friend's name is Carrie Anne. She texted her about some dresses that Allison had borrowed to attend a real estate bowl that had happened in the weeks prior. Yeah. And at 750, Allison replied. Well, a reply came from Allison's phone that said of course I'm sorry that you had to chase them up. I'm attending a conference tomorrow. I can drop them to you by 6:00 tomorrow night, or do you need them before that at 925? Kerry replied.

11:42 All good, need them for next week. Feel like I haven't seen you in ages. Hope everyone's OK. Let's have lunch soon. She never got a reply to that text message. Kerry Anne actually says that the message from Allison was more formal and apologetic than she expected because they were besties. And so she would have. She did. She certainly didn't expect Allison to be like, oh, I'm so sorry. Oh, I didn't give you your addresses back. She would have been just like, yeah, I'll drop them off whenever. You know, we'll figure this situation out.

12:13 Did Jared send the message? Yeah, there's a thought that. Maybe that night it's possible. We don't know. We don't actually know. Jared's account of what happened that night is that at 10:00 he went to bed and Allison was watching The Footy Show with his on her own on the couch. Apparently he's a really deep sleeper. Yeah. Apparently didn't stare at all at all throughout the entire night. He woke at 6:00 AM and Allison wasn't there, but she goes for a walk early sometimes, but she doesn't. But she doesn't.

12:48 But she does.

12:51 Jared was quite concerned when at 7:00 AM she hadn't returned because she had to leave shortly thereafter to leave by 7:00 AM to get 715 or something to leave to the conference. So when she wasn't back by 7, he's like, oh, I'm a bit worried. So he called his dad and sister to come over to look after the girls. Texted her like prior to that saying like, you know, Oh, morning love. Yeah. Yeah, texted Alison. Just. Letting you know, you know, like I'm here and you know when you get back or whatever this is happening.

13:19 Like, and then and then he wrote in that text message. Love Jared. Yeah. Like he wouldn't have written that. No, it's you're not writing a love letter. No, you're writing a text message. Dude, no one signs off a text message. Yeah, yeah. Next time I send you a text, I'm going to sign off Love. Emma. I love Emma because I didn't know he sent me that. Yeah, like a fucking idiot. Like obviously you've staged that. Seriously.

13:42 Now what happened next? He basically decided to go out and look for her in the car they had. They owned two cars. They owned a Holden Captiva, which was only about 8 weeks old. I. Believe. Did I tell you literally? I think we picked up our cars like the same week. Oh wow, Holden Craptivas. Well, your Craptiva just died a few weeks ago. After The Wreckers now I find that I found that really but literally 8 weeks old. At that point I was like, Oh my God, that's like literally the week that we might have must have picked up.

14:14 Our that's so funny as well. That's so funny. They also owned a Prado, Toyota Prado. So when he was out apparently driving the route that she would normally walk on which she didn't normally walk, so I don't know what he was driving, he decided to dial 000 from his car. Prior to that, though, he had actually called his parents, as I mean, because he called them every second of every day and asked their opinions on everything. He got his dad to come over. Yeah. And his sister. His sister. Came over, but his sister actually ended up driving around as well.

14:46 Yeah, just the dad was left at home with the girls. Yeah, they stayed. With the girls, well, he was gonna drive around so obviously. So at this point, like the girls are taken care of, yeah. And watched at home by dad and yeah, so, yeah, so, and he's, but he's in the car, so it's 7:14 AM He decides to call 000. Well, prior to that he did do a Google search to call Queensland police. So he wasn't necessarily looking to call emergency 000, which is our emergency number. But then yeah, dial 000, obviously.

15:18 Well, they. Advised him to dial 000, which I guess is the standard procedure in this case because it needed it. You know a missing person requires it, but. Just that Google search will come up later. Yes, it will, yeah. So he basically said, oh, this is my wife, she's missing. This is really unusual. And the 000 operator basically said that's fine, took down all of her details, like what she was possibly wearing, her height, all that sort of stuff. Yeah. And he's very. Calm in the in the call and that sort of stuff.

15:49 But I guess pretty early to be for an adult going missing. Yeah, I would have probably called friends 1st and all those sorts of things and been a little bit more. I just wouldn't. Wouldn't have thought you'd go there that quickly, no? 'Cause like the other thing that I think pretty early on, I mean, well, the cops rocked up and they were red flag immediately, but we'll get there. But one of the other thing was that they asked him, you know, we kind of, and then down the track of police are involved and they've asked the question.

16:16 Well, have you contacted like the conference? Is she already there? Yeah. Like, has she gone? Yeah. Did she just leave earlier for the conference than you thought? And so and it was like, oh, didn't even think of that. Like then both. Cars were still at the residence, but like then, they were. Like, because she had been picked up by someone, like, and it could. Yeah. So we've only hadn't even actually done any of that due diligence of checking for an adult person. Yeah. Yeah. Hadn't done any of those things.

16:39 It was immediately like, yeah, I'm driving around looking for in random spots. I'll call the police now. Like, it was, it was quite, Yeah. Interesting SO. The 000 operator dispatched 2 constables to 593 Brookfield Rd. Brookfield, which was the house they were renting at the time. These two constables, hats off to the high. They were all over it right from the get go, so they immediately noticed. You'd hope. You'd hope any cop was seeing what they saw. But the fact. That they acted on it, yes. So quickly they you know, they did an amazing job.

17:15 Yes they immediately noticed scratch marks on Jared's face. The house smelt like bleach and was so clean and what? Was his father doing his father? Was putting a vacuum cleaner into the back of his car that. I just want to hear your thoughts on that. Well. Obviously, so this is the other thing that the so the police officers were like, can we have a look around the house? And Jared was like, Yep, absolutely. He was very. Comfortable for him to walk into the house. Yep, he was. More than happy for them to do that now, Jared.

17:45 They they were like, oh mate, how'd you get those marks on your face? And Jared's like, oh, cut myself shaving this morning. Oh, that we put. Photos of them on our socials. They go into the bathroom and they're like, there was not one bloody tissue in the in the waste bin. There was not an any evidence of because there was significant scratches. Yeah, there would have been a lot of blood. Yeah. Not one drop of blood to be found. No, not one bloody tissue in any bin that they looked in, but. What he did do was he'd got up that morning, put on shaving cream and shaved his face.

18:21 Yep, he actually got one of his daughters to come in and watch him do that and help him put a Band-Aid on one of those cuts that didn't. Believe that morning he was implicating his own child. Yep. So that if they asked her or did you see Daddy shaving this morning, they would say, yeah, I even helped Daddy put a Band-Aid on. Fucking piece but that. He didn't. There's no way so. What had what had Nigel been vacuuming up? And, well, what was in that making? Well, I have a theory. Oh please. 'Cause I nothing else gets mentioned of this in anything I've read or heard.

19:02 All I know is he put a vacuum in the back of his boot. What the fuck is he putting a vacuum in the back of his car for? When is? Daughter in law's missing hello, red flag. Well, clearly so the police officers basically said no, you need to leave that, bring that in back inside. You're not putting that in your car no. And then they actually seized the car later on as well for like, as in Nigel's car for forensic testing. But this is my theory as to why he wanted to get rid of the yeah thing. So should I say it now or no?

19:33 You know what? Let's get through the story and then I'll tell you why. OK, no Happy. To come back. All right, cool. So. Yeah, immediately, Jared, that the police officers say. Any reason you think your wife might have gone missing? And she's like, and he was like, well, I did have an affair, but that's well and truly over by now. Oh, but she's been working, but she's depressed. She's really depressed. It's like it was really hard on her. Of course it'd be hard on she might. Be she's been mentally unstable.

19:59 She is taking antidepressant medication and anyway, so they. The other thing he said is like her grey tracksuit's missing from the wardrobe. She's got two track suits. She either wears a black tracksuit when she goes walking or she wears a grey one and the grey one's missing. Yeah, the grey one's missing and her shoes aren't where they normally are. OK, cool, cool, cool. The constables immediately called in their superiors as soon as. They saw those marks on his face. They were like this. Is red black Now when Jared contacted 000, he hadn't even contacted her parents at that point, right?

20:40 So they actually didn't arrive at the house until 11:00 and they state that they went to the house as soon as they found out something was wrong. So they didn't know. I don't know. I don't actually know whether Jared informed them or whether the police informed them that Alison was missing. I don't know. Jared apparently when they walked in and and Jeff Allison's dad said this made his skin prickle but when he walked in in front of the police officers he said to them hi mum and dad. Oh. Allison's parents.

21:13 Oh, that's a bit weird. Very weird. And by the sounds of things to Jeff, if he's got a bit of a prickle from that, that's not normally how we would speak to that. Well, apparently. Sometimes he would, but it was always in in front of other people because really performing when it was. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, now at this point he, Jared, pulled aside. So he's Jared's sister was there, Olivia, Nigel was there, and then Allison's two parents were there. He pulled them all aside and said to them, I've contacted a lawyer.

21:46 Now, Allison's been missing. Sorry, 4 hours by this .5 hours Max if you think from 6:00 AM to 11:00 AM. Yeah, I've contacted a lawyer and I have been advised not to make a formal statement. And Jeff was like why? Why have you contacted a lawyer? Yeah like we don't even know what's going on yet. I think his. Response to that was literally something along the lines of all because you know, they they quite often look at the husband at this time. The police asked whether Gerard would let them photograph his scratches, so they did so at the house at that point.

22:21 Yeah, but it wasn't a forensic photo. So they literally just took a photo of his face. There was no rulers, nothing like that involved. So that comes a bit later. Yeah, that comes later. The police imply like the police were, yeah, just trying to suss out exactly movements and what had gone on that morning. And Gerard was adamant, oh, I would never leave my kids. So I got my dad to come over before I went looking for her. Yeah. OK. Yeah, he refused. To speak to the media that like so the the police asked for a plea to the public, you know, with media and he refused to do that, which meant that her parents then stood there and did that.

23:01 And if you you watch that, it's heartbreaking. They are desperate for any information about where she is as oppo and opposed to that a few days later, because the the media kind of jumped on all this and they were all over him. There is a moment where he does give a an impromptu media. He speaks to the media. This is at the front. Of his mum and dad's house now, because the police had secured their home, is a crime scene pretty much straightaway after that. Yeah, if you watch that one where he speaks, it's like, it's like a moment where I think the public literally go from, you know, oh, could the husband have done this too?

23:36 Oh my God, he's so guilty. He literally the way he speaks in that media moment is just so fake. I know I've written down, oh, I knew I'd written down a quote from that. Oh, yeah, yeah. That appeal that he'd made, the crocodile tears like he's like, no, no tears in his eyes. No. I just want everybody to know that I've helped the police as much as I can. I haven't. No, you haven't. No. He. Categorically was like, you know, but I've let them do everything and I've, I've helped them where I can. I'm just not giving a formal statement.

24:15 Well, actually a formal statement would help. Yeah. I mean, that's, yeah, kind of what they need and you've got nothing. To hide. Why wouldn't you do that? So just really quickly as well, Yeah. When the police secured the house as a crime scene, they also secured the cars that were on the property, and they noticed that in the boot of the Captiva. So apparently there was like a carport type situation. Yes. And the Captiva was reversed into the carport. And then the Prado was kind of like in front of the Captiva, like just a bit off to the side of it, Yeah.

24:45 Bit awkward to get to the Yeah, bit awkward. Little bit yeah, yeah. But also, like, you know, the Captiva was backed in doable. the IT was doable. The police are sort of like looking at the cars and just doing a first, their first visual sort of assessment of what was going on. And they noticed there were kids toys in the back of the Captiva, but they were all nicely boxed. And it's not like they were toys strewn over the car. Like I mean, if you have a look at any of our cars, so. Yeah, like things you know, around in the car, you've got balls.

25:19 You've got kids, Shit. Everywhere, yeah, yeah, this was like placed and where where things would not be then when you were driving around, it was very. And then the housekeeper, yes, Said to the police, those toys have been under the house for years. They're not they're actually, you know, they're 10/8 and five, they don't play with those. They were like. Literal baby toys. Yeah, he'd obviously gotten out of under the house and cigarette. Oh. Yeah, the boots full of things like you kind of put something in there.

25:46 Yeah, because then because the boot was full. Full of kids toys. Yeah, because. Then they found in like, so no, in the Captiva like I do in the 3rd row of Saints in the 3rd row of seats, which like you lay down like, you know, if you're in the boot, like they lay down right. So or you can pull them up and have a third row. There was a belt buckle which had this stain on it, which was described as looking like, like maybe a, a soft drink spill kind of thing as to how it looked to the eye, which was later tested and found to be blood and did return DNA of Ellison bathing clays.

26:23 So yeah, there was clearly something. Going on going. On the boot, yeah, I mean. How? Like, explain to me how Ellison's. Blood. Well, as I said, it was an 8 week old. Eight week old. Car like this isn't, this is. Not in the boot. Too. Like I mean I've got 3 rows in my car, I've literally never been in the back row. I wouldn't have ever like, been in there, no. Same. I know what you mean. Like you just don't. It's the kids that's the kids. Don't like the kids? Go back there, there's barely any. Air back there.

26:49 No, I'm not going there. Freaking air. You've been in life, in the. Back of your Actually that is a funny story one day. This is before you got rid of the captain. Just struggling. Along. I can't even. Remember where we were going? But we had like heaps of people in the car and we were driving into the city for some reason and I was like, I'll volunteer to go in the back back. It's fine, don't worry guys. But unbeknownst to me at that time, I thought it was a. Really hot day, but. Unbeknownst to me, the middle row doesn't even have no, not in a.

27:19 Captain, no, there's no air for any children. Yeah. So not only did the middle row people not have any air, I was like stuck in the back, no windows. I'm like suffocating in there. Wherever we were going, I remember getting out of the car and being like my underwraped. It was freaking. Hot. It was so hot. Bloody hot. That and I was like dripping with sweat. It was so gross. So yeah, don't go in the back. No, no, that's for the kids. The kids, The kids. They deal with heat better. Yeah. Fun. Yeah.

27:47 Yeah, they coat. Yeah. The police have started canvassing the area. Yeah. And they've started to gather statements from neighbors and that kind of thing. And there were multiple reports of, like, different types of screams. Some described it as a Yelp. Some described it as a scream. Three to four different reports of different noises and unfortunately slightly different times. But I think when you know, if someone said, oh, what time did you hear that scream? Like, oh, I don't know. It was like, well, I don't know, 9, but it could have been seven.

28:18 It could have been 10, like, who knows? One neighbor said she heard a sharp, startled Yelp somewhere between 7:30 and 9:00 PM. Another woman said she heard a scream just before 10:00 PM. So there's lots of things going on. But what the police actually found was a neighbor. I, I think it was diagonally across the road from from Allison's house. She came home with her teenage children and her teenage daughter walked through a spider web at about 10:00 and screamed. So now the police are like, well, what are people hearing?

28:57 Are they hearing something that happened with Allison or are they hearing this girl who walked through a spider web having a having a bit of a tanty about it? Yeah, don't blame. Her. Oh well. Yeah, I guess, I mean, and Queensland have some pretty gnarly, yeah. Insects, Yeah. So, OK, fine.

29:17 OK, so by Saturday, the police wanted to know the name and phone number of the woman that Jared had told them when he reported Ellison missing. They wanted to know who that was, this affair that he'd reported. What's her name and number? And he's like, oh, her name's Tony McHugh, but oh, I'd have to go and find her number. I don't know where her number is. Then he's fucking Dick. God, he's a fuck wit. He's straight on the blower to her to say, oh, by the way, the police are about to contact you.

29:48 Seriously, dude, what? He rang? No, he rang her while she was talking to the police. That was later on, I think. Was it always? Yeah, No, I'm pretty sure that was later on. I think that was when they formally interviewed her, right. Well, I think he. Because he rang her and like we're saying to it, we have to lay low. Like, you know, Yeah, that and she's literally being interviewed by the police. Yeah, that was. When he when she was being interviewed. Dickhead they. Asked him around the same time, I think it was in that same phone call where they hit, where they were asking for Tony's number.

30:19 They asked him to come into the station for some forensic photos and he decided to do that. So I don't really get you're cooperating with having photos of these scratches taken, but you're not willing to give a formal statement. So I don't know what that. Is well, I think he had to like, I mean, if he said no, he was that was I think that was more incriminating than anything. Yeah. Because so he he had the scratches on his face. He also had some on his chest, which I'm sorry, I find this hilarious.

30:44 Same that these ones on his chest were really interesting. I, I, I've seen photos of them and you can't really go and kind of get a, a gauge on really what could have created this mess on his chest. Yeah, I'm guessing probably fingernails again and that sort of stuff. But he claimed that he'd been at a cross country event for his daughter at school. And people do remember this incident where he was in this is some days before kind of stuff, the herb going missing that he did really kind of like, oh, oh, wow.

31:14 Something did bite him. Where on the body? I don't know. I thought that there was something on his neck. Yeah. I think someone saw like. A Welt come up. That's true. It was his neck. Now you say that, yes. And so it wasn't. It didn't. Explain chest. But he did. He claimed that oh, I got attacked by cattle. The killer caterpillars now. Later on, this was absolutely disputed by a entomologist who testified at the trial and they were like in Queensland we don't have caterpillars that crawl up things and fall.

31:44 We have, but they also. Don't have anything that create the a bite like. As such, we have ground. Dwelling caterpillars that bite, yeah, but we don't have ones that live in trees and will fall on you and bite you. So no. No. That they'll try again, but there's no way this wasn't a bite. It was they were scratches like it wasn't a bite at all. So that one on. His chest like it almost looks like maybe like a bruise type bruise. Like yes and but still. There was definitely like scratch. Type scraping like yeah yeah, have a.

32:15 Look at the photos online. They're interesting. How? They are interesting, but they also, so they photographed him actually three times at the with the police. So because they by the time they got to the third one, they were like, actually, you know what, we should just get a full body photograph of him. So they they hadn't done the lower half of his body. They'd only done upper half. So they were like, can you come back down again like for another check? Because sorry, the other thing he had was on his hands with scratch Marks and things too that the police noticed again on that very first day.

32:43 But he'd been gardening, Meg. Yes, he. Claimed he'd been guarding and helping his neighbor. Yeah, yeah. But they didn't really present in anything that would have. I've done that because he did. Yeah, he sort of, he did sort of explain that away of how he was doing that. But anyway, so. Yeah. So he's going in for his third photograph of his injuries and what does he do? He runs, drives his car into a pole. No to a. Concrete pylon? Yeah. At a bus stop. At a bus stop, like a not a bus stop, a bus station, yeah.

33:18 But no, there were no skid marks prior to this. Like kind of he'd literally plowed into it. But he was then come like, so he gets out of the car after this accident and falls on the ground and drags himself along the ground as if, you know, like his legs don't now work yelling. Somebody kept my lawyer. I did my lawyer all this drama. And so they've like, they're like, these people are like, they don't know who he is. No one knows who he is. They're like, what is going on? The paramedics do eventually arrive.

33:48 Who again, he kept repeating to them, you need to get my lawyer. My lawyer. I'm not speaking to anyone. I'm not going to tell you anything about what's happened. Like what the paramedics are like, who is this guy? We don't know. They don't know who well, they're thinking. Mental. Some kind of mental health crisis because he's driven his car into hell and although he wasn't actually going up fast, no. But so the then eventually the cops do rock up to this scene and who immediately recognised who he was and his his.

34:16 Lawyer also rocked up his lawyer got. There 'cause they don't know who called him. No, there was no no one at the scene knew who his lawyer was. There were no one other than him would have been able to call the lawyer paramedics. Certainly didn't, no, they don't know who. By the time the police. I think by the time the police got there, the lawyer was already there. He was already there. Yeah, yeah. So who and what they were? And this lawyer was advising these paramedics, saying he's not gonna talk about what's going on, you know, like, and they're like, but who is this guy?

34:40 Like we're actually gonna. Treat this guy who's had a car accident and he kept. Them saying Jerry kept saying I'm so sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry and one of the cops took this moment and asked him are you sorry about the accident or something else mate? And his response was something else. So the cop was like hoping that this was going to be a, you know, a declaration of what it what he was sorry for or some sort of confession, But the lawyer has stepped in and stopped that. So that didn't carry on to getting any, any further information.

35:13 But he's gone off to then the, the, the on the in the ambulance. And obviously this has sort of given the cops a bit of an opportunity here because they have been able to do a full assessment psychologically on him to then to that. What that did was to prove that he was of full sound mind mind. And so. He couldn't then later in court claim insanity in terms of which I think. This is when he has just by by doing whatever the fuck he thought he was doing here, he's actually done himself a massive disservice.

35:40 The only thing? I could think of what he was doing was now or the other thing that did do in the court case was that some of his injuries, some of the scratches and things couldn't be admissible because they couldn't know if they happened at during the car accident it's or most. Notably that chest, that chest injury, because they're like, oh, it's a seat belt from like, yeah, the stopping suddenly on a concrete pilot. And he was actually driving a friend's car at the time too, because I think his car had been in.

36:10 Like their their cars were. Being forensically tested so just fucking Oh my. God, like what on earth? This guy? Seriously, I just can't. He's a weird. Weird dude. All right. So we up to 10 days later, yeah. Ten days later, so. Canoeist is paddling down the Brisbane River which is such beautiful spot stunning and off the Brisbane River is a number of smaller creeks and things that that breakaway into it. Yep, and this Padlet, which he went down this collar Creek, which is not well used at all. He knew of a spot, particularly where he was aiming for.

36:50 It's a lot narrower and a lot more bushy, those sorts of things. So he's paddled down this river, the Creek, sorry, and he's got further in and it and he's unfortunate on the side of the the the RIP, the bank has noticed what he at first he was kind of like, what is that? But he did. He was. No, that's definitely a a body. And he knew it was. Probably Allison by what she was wearing and by the appeal that the place was so. Public. At this point, everyone knew. About it and he could sort of kind of tell the colour of the person's hair.

37:18 Couldn't really make out any other features because unfortunately the body was in a fairly awful state of decomposition and also it was almost, it was inaccessible. So if you have a look at the photos of where her body was found, it was like a really steep and bushy embankment straight into the water. So there was actually nowhere for him to get out of his kayak to actually go and access the. Area and so it was to his under the bridge yeah to. His yes, to his credit, he just paddled as fast as he could, Yeah.

37:46 And found a phone and and contacted the police and they arrived. On scene immediately, yeah. But getting her body out was tricky because of where it was. But they ended up AB sailing. There was a bridge, as you said, and they ended up AB sailing down the bridge to to gather her body and all of the evidence around her body. And again, thankfully they did their jobs the way they were meant to and they collected a lot of forensic samples before they moved her body. And this included samples of the water?

38:14 Yeah. They also any sort of bushes, shrubs, trees, leaves, anything that was on her body, they have bagged and sent away for forensic testing. Yeah. And in all parts of this, I have to say the cops did an an an incredible job. They. Really did, Yeah, yeah. You can't fault. You can't fault them. No. They did everything they were meant to do, and they did it to the NTH degree, yes. Yeah. Have you heard about the couple who lived just off Collar Creek? Yes. So on the road that Collar Creek kind of, you know, that goes down the side of the Creek basically, which is quite remote.

38:56 If you have a look at it on Google Maps, there's not a lot around. It's very bushy area, but let's just. Sort of flag to Jared sold houses in that area. Yep. In the area, yeah, it was about what, 12 KS from where they lived, 1314 KS 13, Yep. Yeah. So yeah, that just gives a bit of so. Not walking distance in that if she's going for a walk before picking, taking the girls off to school, et cetera. I mean this would be a 26K round trip from where she was found and she only had. One hour, yeah. So she's not like if.

39:26 She's left home at 6:00 AM doing half a. Half a marathon, like yeah, no. You know, and she knew she had somewhere to be. She wouldn't. She didn't have time to walk 26 No, you might do a. 5K walk in the morning like I think not 13, that's right. Then back home again, another 13, No. So the wife in this couple was a flight attendant. Yeah. And she had a 5:30 AM call time at the airport, so she had to leave super, super, super, super early. Yeah, during the night, they were awoken by their dog at about 12:30 in the morning.

39:56 The dog was howling. Apparently this is quite unusual, although it had happened a couple of times before and it was like an animal had come onto their property. So they actually went out onto their veranda tablet to see if they could see anything. And what they saw was really interesting. First of all, they heard some mumbling voices. And they saw two cars driving down the road. Now this is a road that not many people drove down during the middle of the day, let alone at 12:30 at night. The first, there were two cars.

40:27 The first car, this is this gets me. The first car had the headlights on. The second car was trailing extremely close behind and did not have the headlights on. Now the first car, they believe the person, the man, the man, the husband of that of that family believed that it was similar to a holding Captiva. SUV style SUV. Hatchbacky type style.

41:02 The coroner attended the site, so let's just leave that the testimony for now. The coroner attended the site and found that the body that they'd found in Color Creek was really badly decomposed, so not immediately identifiable as Ellison. They, the coroner performed ACT scan and found that there were no fractures to her body whatsoever and her hyoid bone was intact. So we made. We know that means she was probably not strangled. Yeah, her lungs. The CT scan of her lungs showed that she hadn't drowned.

41:39 And so her deposit into the Creek, if that had ever happened, say she'd washed up there. Yeah, she hadn't died by drowning. They also. Showed though where the body was and the levels of the water, there was no way that even like the tides et cetera at high tide, the water hadn't reached as far as where her body was found so it's not even though she could have washed up to that point of where she was found yeah, so they. Believe her body had been placed. Her body had never. Been in the water? It was.

42:06 Yeah. Placed further up, yeah, I guess maybe fall into the arrow. Yeah, there. Were three injuries found on autopsy? Yes. The first was a subdural hemorrhage. The second was a chipped tooth. And they don't know exactly when that happened. Yeah, but certainly the haemorrhage was severe enough that it could have caused her death. It was likely to have caused her death. They also found a bruise on her left inner chest wall. Yeah. Which? It wasn't, it was mild, it wasn't what they called. They're sort of spoken as being not as extensive as the head injury.

42:40 Yeah. Due to the level of decomposition of her body, they weren't able to get a blood sample from sort of any venous blood at all. So they were able to get a a sample from her liver for toxicology analysis. And the the analysis did show Zoloft in her system. Yeah, her cause of death was ruled by the coroner as inconclusive. So there wasn't any real smoking gun, No. They couldn't, yeah, pinpoint their cause of death, but did rule it suspicious? Yes. And not Yeah, they didn't. Yeah, they didn't really rule out anything, did they?

43:16 No, they. Didn't rule anything out, No. Allison had three life insurance policies in her name totalling just under $1,000,000. They were taken out well and trillion in advance of her death. So I'm not suggesting that that these were taken out, you know, weeks before she died. 1 was taken out in 2002, were taken out in 2008, and she died in 2012. The suspicious part of this was, though, a week before her death, Jared contacted one of the insurers and asked for details regarding the policy, especially specifically.

43:51 Sorry, payout of the policy. They wouldn't talk to him, but it was noted in their system that he'd made the call. It was. Also noted that he made a call a few days after her body was found asking if since she's dead now, do I still need to continue making the premium payments? So. And when can we get payout? Yeah, you know, he made that call before Allison was positively identified, so. Don't even I didn't hear I just knew it was after but I wasn't sure how far after but it was. Literally the day after they found her body and the coroner still hadn't made.

44:26 I mean, obviously assuming it was her, but it was. Not yeah, absolutely. Everything sort of pointed to the fact that it was probably her, but they had not had definitively had. Identified that I mean there was still a chance you know, low at that, but that randomly you find out oh gosh no this is some poor old or other person like yeah yeah yeah fucking. Asshole. What a Dick. He tried to expedite her birth. Sorry. Her death certificate. Yeah, so that he could get the payouts quicker. Yeah, all. Thankfully all of the policies were actually paid because there was an active investigation involving her death.

45:01 They, the insurance companies, all this happens regardless of of what's going on. The insurance companies will pay out that death benefit, but they will only pay it into a trust. They will not pay it to the beneficiaries. Yes, until that the case is the open case is closed. Absolutely, which is great SOP. Yeah, yeah. Yep, Yep. So, you know, pass. Suck on shit, Jared. You can't get the money that you were so desperately wanting for. And why? Yep. Were you in roughly $1,000,000 worth of debt at this time?

45:37 That's crazy. Crazy no? Yeah. On. May 11th they held her funeral. Can I just? Go back. Just I'm sorry, this is the other bit that just really got to me and it really stood out to me as just being horrific. So when Allison went missing, they actually set up like a command post at Brook filled showgrounds. And so that's where, you know, Gerard was going and well, he was actually not actively participating. He didn't. Actually participate any other searches? Which just blows my mind. Oh, but he had to be.

46:08 There for his kids, even though his kids were being looked after by his mum and dad and he was at the command post 'cause he wanted to know information but he didn't actually wanna help. But the day that Allison's body was found, which was on the 30th of April in 2012, Allison's mum phoned Jared and said I just need to see the girls. Like obviously she was devastated and the likelihood was that the body that they'd found was Allison. So this is as a mother, I cannot even imagine that all.

46:42 I cannot even imagine that. And I'm so sorry that her family had to go through that. And he said, no, you can't see them. Sorry. What the fuck? Why? And then when they when it came time to so obviously then Allison's death, you know, Allison's identity was confirmed and the coroner had released her body and it was time to plan for the funeral. Jared refused to meet with at the house with Allison's mom and dad, and so he offered in his totally generous spirit to meet with Alison's dad at a park. Huh.

47:22 But only. Alison's dad. What? Yeah, that's the. Weirdest thing ever. It's so fucking. Weird, he would all he. Wanted to be together and wait for it, he. Brought a digital recorder Oh yeah to the conversation and recorded it. Cock. He had demands, yeah. Yeah, so his demands. Were. Oh, sorry. Yeah, No, no, no. It's fine. No, totally. Go for it. Go for it. His demands? Were Yeah, there must be a Scout emblem on the front cover of the funeral booklet. What the Now they had Alison. By this stage she had 0 involvement with the Scouts, no?

47:56 And he was unsuccessful in what he did with the scouts, Yeah. Oh, but Baden, Baden, Baden, Baden. He wanted to make A and he called it a speech. Yeah. At her. Funeral. And he wanted to be the last person to speak. Yeah. Was there another demand? I feel like there were. More than that, or something to do with the girl, his threat was that if he didn't have all these things met that he wouldn't let the girls attend the funeral. What the fuck? How do you use your children? Because he's in that moment.

48:30 Absolute cock. What? He's an absolute cock. 600 people attended the funeral and the police were, you know, hoping that they would be able to catch him out. So they actually put a recording device in the flowers that were on top of Alice that was coffin that that he would. Arrive early enough that he would have like some time just with her, like as you would as a grieving husband in, in a normal scenario, the first to arrive, the 1st to arrive have some time just you and her like, you know, kind of stuff to have your moment of goodbye.

49:02 And so they thought that it might be an opportunity that he might speak openly to coffins kind of thing and that they would record then that that and see what they could get with that. But unfortunately he arrived late to the funeral with the with the girls. So they unfortunately missed that opportunity to have that. But hats off to them to thinking of it. Oh no, I love. It love it. Yeah, 'cause they were on. To him, yeah. They. Were oh, they were on to him on 20th of July. Yeah, I believe. Yeah, I believe.

49:31 One of the very senior police officers in Queensland police at the time attended the funeral and went up, went up to to Jared at the end and shook his hand and said mate, I'm really sorry for your loss. And Jared said to him I really hope you find who did this. And he looked in dead in the eye and said, we will, don't you worry, we'll get him. I love that. Oh, I love it because he one. 100% knew. He knew, of course, at that point who. Who did this? Yeah, I love that. I would have loved to have been him in that moment.

50:04 I know. I know. Yeah, yeah. I hope Jared chat himself because at the end. So let's just say, like at the funeral, Jared didn't speak. Yeah, he actually didn't give a speech at all at the funeral, to Jeff's credit, 100% because, I mean, the funeral now knowing what, you know, the outcome of the fact that he was eventually convicted, you know, that you wouldn't want him as a memory of speaking at her funeral. So he actually just didn't allow any of those things that he said to Jared, like what Jared Aldridge demands we're not met.

50:35 Yeah, Jeff didn't allow him to even give a speech, which I just go Dad, you know, like go dad. Go on his protect for his daughter like. Oh, yeah, yeah. So well done, Jeff. You're, you are a good bloke. Yeah. Yeah, On the 12th of June 2012, Jared was charged with Ellison's murder. So this was, they had a strong circumstantial case. They didn't have a smoking gun. I guess so. But by this stage they were like, well, I think they they were kind of, they had to do something. Yeah. There was no more evidence to be gathered.

51:07 They had to try and come up with a case. There's a lot of public pressure. On them too to like I mean everyone was like it's him like yeah because in the court of. Public opinion it was him, but they had to make sure that the case would step up in a court of law, which they felt. Very confident in their circumstantial evidence. It was very compelling. It had done everything that they could in terms of, I mean, I love the the you could probably speak a bit more medically on this in terms of the biologist who they brought in to look at the leaf and the the other botanist.

51:34 So there was a number of foliage bits and pieces that were found within her hair and those sorts of things that this guy came in. He was a local guy, but he also did work for the government. He was legit. It wasn't just some random person they brought in to do this. He was, it's, he was in the role to do this, but just happened to be a local. And he found that there were none of those particular bits of stick sleeves, whatever that were found were not to be found in the area where her body was found.

52:00 There was none of that was there. So they were only present at the Badenclay residence. Sorry this. Man is incredible. His name is Doctor Gordon Geimer. Yeah. He was the director of the QLD Herbarium. So they, they provided us an A free identification service. So if you were, if you lived in the area and you had a plant or a shrub or something that you wanted identified, you could actually take it to them and they would identify it for you for free, even when. It's dead when I do that. To them, yours are unidentifiable by the time you've gotten to them.

52:30 So they engaged his so they they paid him to come and have a look at the site and and all of that. And he what he found they out of the six exhibits that they'd taken off Allison's body before they moved her, there were two species that were found at Collar Creek and four that were not. He then, in his own time, over 2 weekends, attended 500 different sites, Yeah, in and around the area, basically from Color Creek all the way back to where the Baden Clays lived, to their house and slightly beyond their house.

53:09 He was not able out of those 500 data points, he was not able to find one other place that contained all six. All six of. Those, yeah, species that were found, yeah. He found one site out of 500 that had five of them. Yeah, none of the rest. None of any of the 500 had all six aside from the Badenclay's backyard, Yeah. One of them in particular was hanging off of like the route, the carport where the Captiva was parked. So the thought is of like sort of as getting her into the boot of the car was hanging literally right there shoulder or something.

53:48 Yeah that there's her hair's got, you know, caught on that as he's like putting her in the boot of the car 'cause that's literally where this whatever sort of Ivy, I don't know, plants are not my thing. Again hanging off of the the roof of the carport. So I mean, yeah, circumstantial, yes, but fuck me. Like we're pretty, pretty close here to finding out that she was definitely at home. Yes. And then at Color Creek, yes. And not walking along to Color Creek or, you know, and the other thing was that they really flex obviously with no fractures and things like that, falling wasn't really a possibility, but only that where her body was was under the bridge.

54:27 So she couldn't have say jumped off the bridge or fallen off the bridge. And we know she. Hadn't been in the water, no. There was no water in her lungs or anything, so it's not like she'd accidentally drowned and washed up there, no OR. Tripped and fallen from the, you know, the top of the bank. They had to fall there. It just wasn't happened. It was impossible. Yeah. So the circumstantial evidence that they had at this point was scratch marks on his face and chest and obviously he had the like wounds on his hands as well.

54:53 They had the blood in the car in the Captiva. They had the affair, yeah, they had the insurance and when he tried to all of the the timing of all of that. Can I just? One thing about the scratches on his face too. Yes, so the in the days after he went to see a doctor, right that he on his off his own bat, you know, off his own bat, went to the doctors to get them checked out to prove, you know, no, they're they're razor cuts, right to actually went to two different doctors. He went to two. So the first one said, oh, no, no, I'm pretty sure they're not razor cuts.

55:22 The second one, he went to a female doctor. She just happened to have had the extensive experience in her training around razor cuts and categorically was like, they're not razor cuts. No, I just. Love that he found the one doctor in Queensland who was an expert expert in it and against him though. Yeah, absolutely. But not only that, let's hit the nail on the head. With that, he left that appointment with her handing over his business card saying if you ever want to catch up for coffee, give me a call.

55:54 He hit on her. He was. There Yep to. His wife to. Disprove the fact that he'd had any involvement in his wife's disappearance. Yep, but if he could get some, he'd try it. Oh, because there's. Another moment where another agent, not Tony Mccue, another agent altogether, where he'd hit on her and he and she her response, she rejected him. She said on I'm not interested. And he goes, well, if you're not interested in that job, I've got another job for you. Do you need my wife killed? Oh yeah, whoops, what an idiot.

56:28 Got his. I mean, that was and that was well before she was murdered, but like, Oh my God, the other. Circumstantial evidence they that they have is that 2 days before Alison went missing Jared Google taking the 5th and he also then googled self incrimination minutes before dialling 000. Yeah. So there's a little bit around. This there is a bit around this, so I'll take the taking the fifth one if you want. So apparently the night that he googled taking the 5th, which was a couple of days before Alison went missing, he and his mum and mummy and daddy yeah were watching The Good Wife, an episode of The Good Wife that was airing on TV that night.

57:08 And the police have actually gone back and actually, no, sorry, his defence team went back and found that during The Good Wife, taking the 5th was actually mentioned three times. And so their explanation for that was that he was just Googling to see what that actually meant after watching The Good Wife. Now I can, I can actually come at that because taking the 5th isn't something that we have in Australia. It's not an Australian. I mean, taking we know. I mean, I know from watching American TV shows.

57:39 Taking the 5th means you're not, you don't speak when you're asked a question to incriminate yourself. Yeah, you're not going to increase. So yeah, to stop you from self incriminating. He might not have known that because he was a dip shit, but in context of the show I. Think he could have probably figured it out figured that out, but maybe they. Wanted an exact definition but I think what. He wanted to know was does that apply in Australia, not just America? Because then, but they were. Able to explain that away.

58:07 So that was then and. They also take that as they. Want Yeah, so they. It can also. Basically what happened was though the the final search, so after searching for taking the 5th, the next Google search was around incrimination, yeah, self incrimination. So and that supposedly was the last search he made prior on the day on the phone. Now what they've actually proved though is that it they all happened at the same time because when he opened up his phone to search for the Brisbane police. Police number.

58:44 The phone what and might your phone will still do it to this day. It's not even just a 2012 thing of like, you know, your browser reopens and so it can it like researches like it opens up refreshes again. Yeah. So it looks as though you've searched for it at that time when actually, in actual fact, the search was done a few days prior. OK, so still don't think I still think that he was kind of like, oh, this one. Does think what if that would apply to me? Yeah. I don't think that there that it's not completely.

59:10 Innocent but but. There is. AI guess a legitimate explanation. Yeah, I don't think he's legitimate on the. Day of of actually, you know, the morning of him doing this, I don't think he's done that and kind of then gone. Oh, now I'll ring the police. Yeah. Agreed. I think he's. Done that the days prior with all this going through his mind, I still think that that incriminates him to intent, yeah. Although, OK, we can let's just say we scrap the taking the 5th, we scrap the self incrimination. Did you know, I didn't know this until looking into this, but did you know that your iPhone records when you plug your charger in?

59:40 Yes. So he actually plugged his charger in for his iPhone at 1:46 AM the morning. But he was. Asleep he was. In a deep sleep from 10:00 PM till 6:00 AM. Never woke, never stirred, but his phone was. Plugged in at 1:46 AM His. Defense team said that Allison had plugged that in. Don't. Think she can do that from Color Creek? No, it's a bit. Far sorry also you have to no, I'm never going to say that. So the other thing is that when they did the forensic search of his phone, the police said there was a FaceTime phone call from his phone to his dad's phone at 12:30 AM.

1:00:27 This actually was then found to not be true because his dad's phone was unable to receive a FaceTime phone call because he had a much older iPhone. So they think that that didn't happen, but then his dad, like what explains the two cars? I reckon maybe not a FaceTime call happened. Maybe a another like a normal phone call happened because and then and you could see that something had tried to be deleted at that time too. They know he tried to delete something, but they could they didn't know what he'd tried to delete.

1:00:58 I reckon he tried to delete the phone call to call his dad and be like, fuck, I fucking murdered Alison, what do I do? And then his dad comes. They take Alison in the Captiva to Colorado Creek. Then they bring the Captiva back. But the dads followed in his car. For some reason. I don't really understand what they were they were they planning on leaving the Captiva there? I don't really. Maybe that was. Part of the thought process. And they were like, oh, no, maybe she walked to here. Maybe. I don't think there's been a whole like, you know, discussion about how we're going to stage this now, like obviously.

1:01:28 That woman, the flight attendant and her husband saw two cars. They both saw the two cars and they. And I don't know how much credibility there is in this because I haven't read the book, but and I believe it's in the book that there's mention of her saying I know who the man I can identify. Yeah, she. So that is true. I've gotten to that point. Yeah. So she says that I know who I saw. Yeah. But they haven't actually released that in the book because they're worried about being liable for. For that.

1:02:03 So yeah, take the fact what you will, there's no, there's not really any further information to that in the book. No, you're not actually. Going to get much? Further there. Yeah, right. So he's been arrested. Yeah. He's been denied bail at his at his initial bail clearing. Thank the justice system for that. Absolutely. He was found guilty of murder on the 15th of July 2014. It was obviously the trial only. The trial went for six weeks 4 weeks. Just over 4 weeks, OK, right. Yeah. The jury took a little while to come to their conclusion.

1:02:35 But not I think. I think it was 5. Days, yeah, yeah. Four or five days, yeah. However, these charges were downgraded due to an appeal by his defence on the 8th of December to manslaughter. Now he the claim was that manslaughter wasn't sort of considered and wasn't able to be considered by the jury. Now I'm kind of disgusted by this whole application to the court, to the appellate. Court. Yeah, And how they. Came to this conclusion that it was so that it was a downgrade to manslaughter. They basically said that it was intractably neutral on his issue of intent of to kill now.

1:03:21 So within the within the trial, they were basically saying that there was nothing that proved his intent. He had intent to kill and that entirely and even his actions after the murder were neutral to his intent. So I have a real issue with this. And I really feel like that there needs to be legal action in terms of a redefining of what intent is and how it can be presented. Because plain and simply, if he had, because the definition between the difference of manslaughter and and murder, is this intention that you had to kill or to to was it grievous bodily harm?

1:04:03 So he clearly whether he intended to kill her that night, he intended to cover it up. And get away with that. I think there was intent to kill anyway, so. That to me equals intention absolutely. Have a think about the phone call he made to the insurance company a week before she died. There was like. What's going? He was, absolutely. And the even the comment to the the real estate person. Oh well, you know, why don't you? Or I could give you the job of killing my wife. The thought of. Killing his his wife had been on his mind enough the on that night whether he walked into that house that night going yet tonight.

1:04:37 So I'm going to murder her or whether or not an argument ensued any. And then in that that's happened. That's still intent, I think. The fact that Tony had found out that Allison was attending the conference, Tony wasn't happy that that because Tony had only just found out that Allison was attending the same comp same conference as her that day. And she'd said to to Jared, you need to let her know. Like, I'm not happy about this. This is fucked, basically. Yeah. And like that to me as well, is a potential motive.

1:05:09 I don't. I actually don't think that he cared too much for Tony Mccue. Like as in like, I actually don't think, and I don't think he killed her. I don't think he killed Alison to be with Tony. Oh no. I agree, right. I fully agree with that. So I think it was. Obviously a catalyst in terms of their argument, all those sorts of things. I completely agree with that. Yeah. So what they, they also said at this appeal was that there was not enough evidence of a relative motive. Now you don't have to prove motive for murder.

1:05:38 However, come back to what motive in this scenario is. We talked about the financial, financial gain of like $1,000,000 that he would get out of her, her. Insurance. And he cared about money. He did. Absolutely care about money, but I also think plain and simply his ego was being hit. Now he had a failing business that his partners, etcetera, who had said to him he needs to bring in other people to fix this. And one of those people was his wife who was well respected and good at what she did. What if, what if she comes in and fixes this?

1:06:16 That can't happen because then it looks like I, Jared, can't run the business, but my wife can. So I think an an ego blow to him as well was the fact that his partners what well, you're no longer allowed. You're no longer authorized to make any payments. Nope. But they let Allison, Yep, because she. Was. Decent and. And AD able to do these things. Yep. So this all then goes back to the fact that I'm sorry, he was a narcissistic piece of shit. Yeah, so I was actually reading a medical article around this link between all these narcissist people and murder.

1:06:49 Sure. Narcissistic rage stronger grounds for in this particular case, this is actually one around the Ellison batting Clay. OK, so a medical article written about this. OK, there are strong grounds for concluding that he had narcissistic personality disorder, a consequence of which can be particular susceptibility to narcissistic injury and narcissistic rage if the person perceives themselves as threatened by attack to their reputation and integrity. So I honestly believe his whole intent here was Allison is showing me up.

1:07:23 Yep, and that can't happen. Yep. Plus by getting rid of her I have a financial gain and I can I then have fixed the problem in my business and I look good again. So I walk away from this says look at this, this man has put up with he's like, you know, he's lost his wife and he's fixed his business all at once and got in. Look at him. He's doing so well. So you. Think the timing that actually makes a lot of sense. So the timing, Allison had started tipping the business in the right direction in terms of her fixing.

1:07:50 He was in her involvement to the point where he could then kind of take that over and take that on himself and and be the hero in that story. Yeah. But if she was around, they would look. Couldn't she do that? She it would everyone been like, oh, thank God you brought Allison in. She's she's fixed this. She's amazing. She's which? Yes, amazing. She, she, that's. Exactly what she would have done I I actually reckon that that was a smart move to do is bring in that intelligent woman who knew what to do to fix this.

1:08:17 Yeah, who had skill set in this Yeah, and then. But that wouldn't have looked good for him 'cause he's the little wife's. Come in and fix this. Not you, mate. Yeah, my. God, yeah. I really, honestly feel like more research needs to be done. Yeah, into this narcissistic personality disorder, the link to DV, all those sorts of things because we are having way too many women lose their lives to men they know, most likely intimate partners. We lost 101 women in 2024 in Australia to this kind of scenario.

1:08:48 We are on track again this year to the same number. We've lost 12 women, women already with today's the 28th of February at 12 for the year. It's not good enough. And if we need as a society need to know this information about people, and I'm not saying every narcissist is a murderer, but coercive control and narcissism is. There's so much in that that if we do more research into that and knowing, understanding these personality disorders, we can do more to protect women. Well said. Well said. Yeah.

1:09:19 Ellison's family So the three girls went to live with their maternal grandparents. And so they ended up raising their grandchildren, and they've turned. Out to be amazing. Amazing. Young women, I believe they're Ellison Dickey's eldest daughter is a ballerina. They all go. By Dickey. They don't. They don't hold the beaten clay name. Yep, they've. Gotten rid of it and of course they have and they are now the faces of the Ellison Betting Clay foundation. I believe they use that name still because it's recognizable to people in the media.

1:09:59 Although Ellison is referred to as Ellison Dickey on the website. They are an amazing foundation and they, the girls and Ellison's family and friends, you know, they, they use the, the funds that are sort of gathered by the foundation to create awareness for women in similar situations to Ellison. Their mission is to create a Queensland community that acknowledges the prevalence of domestic and family violence. And they're doing a really good job. Really good. Job they had this day of like a be kind day which just is lovely yeah that's their.

1:10:33 Motto they've you can actually buy if you want to jump on the website, you can buy like these really cute T-shirts and stuff that say be kind and have different slogans. So, yeah, just, you know, they're, they're those girls have been through so much. Ellison's mum and dad and her siblings have been through so much. And her friends, who they all love her, loved her so much. And, you know, for everything they've been through, they've been able to, you know, put together this foundation in her memory.

1:10:59 So what a what a lovely legacy to such a horrific circumstance. In her journal, one other quote that we have out of there was that she she actually wrote that she for one of her wishes for her and Jared was that he treat me with dignity and respect. That is the absolute bare minimum. Absolute bare minimum from your husband. So if you are feeling though you are not being treated with dignity and respect, get yourself out, get help. Yeah, yeah. And it's not your fault. I just realized how long this episode's going for.

1:11:36 Sorry, everyone. There was a lot to cover. Yeah. Look, we'll, we'll finish it up really, really quickly. Thank you to everybody for listening today. TuneIn next week and we are covering the Farquhsen boys. That's another Australian. We isn't that what we're doing? No, I thought. We were doing Belle Gibson. Oh, we. Are too, Oh my God, sorry we are. The Farquhsen boys are coming up so don't get too disappointed. We are covering Belle Gibson, so have a watch of the Apple Cider vinegar documentary on Netflix, which I don't believe is completely true to life events, but you know, it gives you a bit of an idea.

1:12:09 She's a very interesting character in and of herself. Thank you so much for listening today. We know it's been a long one, but we really appreciate it. If you'd like to buy us a coffee, you can do so at buymeacoffee.com/two Crime Besties All one Word. And please follow us on our socials, Tiktok, Facebook, Instagram, like and subscribe all of the things. Thank you so much and we'll see you next week. Stay curious. Crime besties. Bye.